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Silicon Valley's best kept secret: Founder liquidity

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Re: Silicon Valley's best kept secret: Founder liquidity

#431

Post by throaway893 »

onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #348
Finbarr wrote: post #66

Secondary at Series A is very rare. Part of the reason more early employees don't get included in secondary sales is because of the Securities Exchange Act of 1934 14e-2. If you have more than 10 sellers involved, the transaction can be considered a tender offer, which triggers additional regulatory requirements and disclosures. > As of 4 months ago I left a very successful stealth startup (which grew to 40M in ARR i…

Especially 5 years down the road when you own ~30% of a $100M company - but you know there's a decent chance you'll walk away with very little, if not nothing - while your peers are all making ~$1M per year working 6 hour days at FAANG with a life partner, maybe kids, and a sizable net worth that isn't going away. Sure, you've got a decent chance to rocket past them in wealth. But they've got everything they really w…

You are completely detached from the real world. Even in super rich countries like the US there are a lot of people without savings, living paycheck to paycheck. Most/all software engineers outside the US can only dream of ever earning that much money. And yet here you are, worrying that you'll end up only slightly richer than people earning ~$1M per year.

Re: Silicon Valley's best kept secret: Founder liquidity

#432

Post by BeFlatXIII »

joenot443 wrote: post #323
burutthrow1234 wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Please let us all know how that's working out for you in 5-10 years. 4 months in and no stress? Must be easy riding from here! Honestly VC-funded startups seem like a cake walk compared to actually starting a small business. Your biggest challenge is walking into a room full of rich dudes and schmoozing for your pay cheque. If you fail you get acquired and get golden handcuffs. If you start a real business you can…

The most common endgame for a startup is slowly running into the ground until the money runs out and you eventually shut the doors. Failing your way into a happy acquisition isn’t really something to expect as a contingency, I don’t think.

Then use those five years to enjoy the fanciest office equipment VC money can buy. Don't cry because it's over; smile because it happened.

Re: Silicon Valley's best kept secret: Founder liquidity

#433

Post by randerson »

geepeeyoudata wrote: post #316
koalaman wrote: post #266

I recently left a long career in FANG to roll the dice on an early startup. I was pretty surprised by the uneven terms between founders and early employees. From what I could tell the early employees takes more risk than the founders because they don't get that magic token dollar turning into their share of the founding equity event and have to pay the fictional valuation of the seed to convert their options. Dependi…

I worked at a Series A startup as an employee, and wont be doing that anymore. Early engineers have all the risk (lose job the second things go bad) but little upside. They would offer 500 options, or 1000 options, or 30,000 options -- but when you look at the prices, that was worth $100-$10,000. Why would anyone take all this risk, and lower base salaries for that lottery ticket?! Secondly, they wont share the cap t…

My experience was similar, right down to the $10,000 worth of options. Eventually the company went public and those options would have been worth $5M if I'd had the foresight (and cash) to exercise them (which I didn't). The co-founders did not have exercise costs or AMT of course. It is an unfair system indeed. I'd encourage those seeking to be early engineers to go work at a FAANG for a few years before joining a startup so that you have the cash reserves to take the risk.

Re: Silicon Valley's best kept secret: Founder liquidity

#434

Post by philipov »

onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #348
Finbarr wrote: post #66

Secondary at Series A is very rare. Part of the reason more early employees don't get included in secondary sales is because of the Securities Exchange Act of 1934 14e-2. If you have more than 10 sellers involved, the transaction can be considered a tender offer, which triggers additional regulatory requirements and disclosures. > As of 4 months ago I left a very successful stealth startup (which grew to 40M in ARR i…

Especially 5 years down the road when you own ~30% of a $100M company - but you know there's a decent chance you'll walk away with very little, if not nothing - while your peers are all making ~$1M per year working 6 hour days at FAANG with a life partner, maybe kids, and a sizable net worth that isn't going away. Sure, you've got a decent chance to rocket past them in wealth. But they've got everything they really w…

[flagged]

Re: Silicon Valley's best kept secret: Founder liquidity

#435

Post by moneywoes »

htrp wrote: post #401
icedchai wrote: post #392

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or, based on examples I've witnessed, 5 years down the road you own 20% of a $1M company because your forecasts were off by an order of magnitude. You've gone through a couple down rounds, where investors took at least 20% each time. You feel obligated to your investors and employees, while there is almost zero chance of walking away with anything.

One thing that is underappreciated in the startup mythos is just closing up shop and trying again.

do investors allow that

Re: Silicon Valley's best kept secret: Founder liquidity

#436

Post by [deleted] »

CSMastermind wrote: post #358
palata wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

$200k? Do you live in a place where this is considered a bad salary?

It's normally considered a bad salary in comparison to what you could be making. I won't speak for the poster but I left a ~$1m / year TC job ($300k base the rest RSUs) to join a startup. I have a good salary compared to the population at large but it's a fraction of what I could be making on the hope that my equity turns into something meaningful that makes up for it.

[deleted]

Re: Silicon Valley's best kept secret: Founder liquidity

#437

Post by aketchum »

sleepingreset wrote: post #305
throwailearner wrote: post #297

Posting from throwaway so I can be very open. I joined a YC startup as engineer #1 with close to $200k salary and 2% options vesting at the usual 4 years, with a 10 year window. I feel like this was bettern than usual, and for a while felt like I struck an awesome deal, but as time went on I realised I was building everything single-handedly, while getting (at best) 2%, which started to annoy me deep down. Over two y…

out of college directly, would you recommend a similar position? looking for early career options

i joined as founding engineer as my second job, 2 years after college. The founders were the same age which I think let them consider a young founding engineer. It worked out for me and I think if you have the opportunity then it is a great time to take the plunge. Knowing what I know now I would likely not take the same role at 30 due to lifestyle requirements (have wife and house now, back then I was paying very little for rent with roomates and had no issue with 12 hour days. I think the risk can make sense early in your career but most founders probably dont want to risk it on an untested dev with sub 3 YoE.

Re: Silicon Valley's best kept secret: Founder liquidity

#438

Post by RhodesianHunter »

throaway893 wrote: post #431
onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Especially 5 years down the road when you own ~30% of a $100M company - but you know there's a decent chance you'll walk away with very little, if not nothing - while your peers are all making ~$1M per year working 6 hour days at FAANG with a life partner, maybe kids, and a sizable net worth that isn't going away. Sure, you've got a decent chance to rocket past them in wealth. But they've got everything they really w…

You are completely detached from the real world. Even in super rich countries like the US there are a lot of people without savings, living paycheck to paycheck. Most/all software engineers outside the US can only dream of ever earning that much money. And yet here you are, worrying that you'll end up only slightly richer than people earning ~$1M per year.

I don't think you fully understand the context in which this was written, but you probably should before passing so much judgement.

Re: Silicon Valley's best kept secret: Founder liquidity

#439

Post by s17n »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #5

Hmm, I’ll be controversial. Twinned secondaries, i.e. secondaries tied to a primary, are almost always a give away to senior management and the buyer. (They’re frequently syndicated at double-digit spreads.) If the company sucks, senior management gets cash back first while the investor gets top-of-stack liquidation preferences. If the company is doing great, the investor gets to buy stock at a price almost always lo…

> They’re frequently syndicated at double-digit spreads

What does this mean?

Re: Silicon Valley's best kept secret: Founder liquidity

#440

Post by apantel »

verticalscaler wrote: post #259
SOVIETIC-BOSS88 wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank God someone said this. Of course it is stressfull, there is no free lunch. If you can't take the heat just dont enter into a such top-heavy game.

[flagged]

And change.
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