Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's not justification, but the reality. War is horrible and innocent people will always die in war.
Genocide has no justification
It depends on the context - just ask the presidents of Harvard, MIT and UPenn
'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture
431–440 of 1001 posts
Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture
#432Earlier quoted context omitted.
You’ve been in touch with Palestinians use HN? Not to seem one-sided, I didn’t realize Gazans had sufficient internet access, let alone food or water, to browse HN.
When I said "HNers on the other side of the conflict" I had in mind users who aren't necessarily Palestinians but have strong identification with their plight. However, it's worth saying that HN has some valued members in Gaza (as well as in the West Bank, of course, and Palestinians in other places). Here's one memorable example: https://news.ycombinator.com/posts?id=daliaawad , My experience as a Gazan girl getting…
Are you aware of any Gazans that are normally active on HN, and if so, if they are ok?
(It is heartbreaking that you have to add "we don't know if Dalia is alive" when talking about her.)
Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture
#433Those are the most serious allegations: "The men and teenage boys were taken to a warehouse where they sat on a bare floor covered in scattered grains of rice. There they were beaten, interrogated and verbally abused. There was no sleep, and the grains of rice cut their skin as they sat there, undressed." A man claims: "Some people didn’t return from the torture sessions. We would hear their screams and then nothing.…
> I'd say that we should not fool ourselves in that the military operation in Gaza is Israel defending itself ("Israel's right to defend itself" is now a commonplace phrase) rather than avenging itself. You may think it is justified in doing so but it still is payback imho. This is absolutely not the case. A few other people have written about why your numbered list makes this clear, but I want to take a different ta…
> It's because Israelis truly feel, to their core, that Hamas has proven themselves to be an enemy that must be destroyed, otherwise Israelis are just never going to be safe again.
Has there been public debate in Israel wheter:
1. It is realistic to eradicate Hamas. 2. To what extent Israel's operation will sow new hate and resistance among the Palestinians, so that the risk of future attacks increases, whether that be by Hamas or any other resistance group.
Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture
#434All: if you're going to comment in this thread, please do not do so in the spirit of battle. The latter is off topic here, and the last thread HN had about this did not do well enough at keeping to the site guidelines: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html . Instead, ask first whether you can find a place of compassion in yourself before commenting. If you can't, that's understandable, but then please don'…
It's hard to find compassion when the truth is hard to find, on either side. And I trust Al Jazeera (and some Israeli newspapers) less on this topic than other sources.
I definitely feel Palestinians have legitimate grievances but on the other hand I fear people's natural compassion being used to prolong a war rather than end it.
Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture
#435Earlier quoted context omitted.
Thank you, Dang. As someone on the Israeli left I feel like I'm between a rock and a hard place- I do not condone Netanyahu and his government and am indeed very critical of Israeli governments of the past decades. But on the other side, my 78 year old mother is fleeing to shelter every couple hours as my hometown (not anywhere near the west bank or the Gaza strip) gets hit by rockets, as do my young nieces and nephe…
A close friend of mine lived in Israel for a long time, and I got the sense that your feelings are echoed by many. It's too easy for people in America and Europe to sit at their desks and repost propaganda on social media in favor of "their side".
There are plenty of Israelis on all sides of this issue.
There are also plenty of Israelis who frequent HN, btw (like me).
Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture
#436Earlier quoted context omitted.
I skim through headers of 100+ vote submission daily, and since 7.10 I haven't seen anything about this conflict until recently, and now this is second in last week. Since the discussion usually tend to be broad topic rather than specific link, this feels a lot (I left a single comment last time and was flooded by responses). Both entries are talking negatively about Israel (I think specifically Al Jazeera is not ver…
Yes - the reason is that it slowly started to dawn on me that we can't avoid this topic altogether and still remain within the intended spirit of this site. That took a while, and it's probably better to have waited in any case, because otherwise the odds of reflective rather than reflexive responses ( https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sor... ) would have been even lower than they currently are…
>> the reason is that it slowly started to dawn on me that we can't avoid this topic altogether and still remain within the intended spirit of this site.
Pleasantly surprised to see you state/admit this - thanks dang <3
Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture
#437I suspect a very large number of people are too smart to speak up, but also resentful of the forces that work to prevent actual nuanced dialogue. That's certainly the sentiment in my bubble.
As somebody who isn't fond of the idea of an ethnostate and sees atrocities coming from all of the actors here, I don't feel comfortable speaking up due to the lack of nuance in public forums.
Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture
#438Earlier quoted context omitted.
> However supportive of Israel one may be and how repulsed one should be by Hamas, I'd say that we should not fool ourselves in that the military operation in Gaza is Israel defending itself ("Israel's right to defend itself" is now a commonplace phrase) rather than avenging itself. I’ve felt that as well, and I would add that even if you feel every action is justified I am skeptical that it’s not counterproductive.…
I think an even bigger driver of terrorism than conflict is the fact that most people in Palestine have lived their entire lives in a state wholly governed by terrorists. From birth, children constantly hear how murdering Jewish civilians is one of life's holy accomplishments, how Jews are all racist liars, how Israel shouldn't exist, how Hamas is their rightful glorious leaders, etc. You shouldn't underestimate the…
I don’t want to discount the effects of that but most people are also capable of knowing when they’re not getting the whole story. Only around a quarter of Palestinians approved of Hamas before the war.
Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture
#439Earlier quoted context omitted.
Hamas statements have said it's about killing Jews and it being the moral duty of Palestinians to do that and sacrifice their children to the cause. It's religious in at least one direction. It was about land once. I suspect, to throw the exact level of thinking on the table by these people, about as worthy as a meme at this point.
Any source for Hamas saying it wants to kill Jews. I read it was in their charter but they removed it ~20 years ago
There's also their senior official saying they will essentially repeat the Oct 7 attack until Israel is completely destroyed
https://news.yahoo.com/hamas-member-says-repeat-attacks-0656...
Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture
#440[flagged]
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Hmm, On the other hand.
>Antisemitism (also spelled anti-semitism or anti-Semitism)[a] is hostility to, prejudice towards, or discrimination against Jews.
I'm a fellow fan of looking into words' etymologies, but it would seem that antisemitic has not had much to do with 'semitic' for quite some time.