Google reports soaring attrition among Black women • Hacker News Board

Re: Google reports soaring attrition among Black women

#431

Post by Traster » Sun, Jul 04, 2021, 2:55 PM UTC

ramblerman wrote: post #261

Traster wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see this criticism of CRT/wokeism etc very often and I really want to address a point about people talking past each other. Proponents of CRT don't say they want to divide people based on group characteristics, they say people are divided based on group characteristics and they recognise that whilst individualists deny what is evidently true. Essentially it's the position that people are negatively impacted due to…

The remedy to injustice is to treat people on their merit. Not come up with different ways to divide them in the name of social justice. > I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character. I have a dream today.

If there is injustice, then the correct response is to recognise it and combat it, not to do nothing whilst it continues. The problem with your appeal to treating people on merit is often merit is the result of unequal conditions. So all you’re doing is baking in the existing inequality and then quite insultingly tell people “oh it’s a meritocracy” . It’s not a coincidence that the most privileged people end up having incredibly meritorious children.

Re: Google reports soaring attrition among Black women

#432

Post by tester756 » Sun, Jul 04, 2021, 4:31 PM UTC

jedberg wrote: post #421

motogpjimbo wrote: post #413

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The biases must be subtle indeed if you are unable to describe one and have to resort instead to an absurd thought experiment.

Runner is to Marathon as Regatta is to_________________ (You need to be wealthy and coastal to know what a Regatta is) If you have a number system where each place is a power of two greater than the one next to it, and only the digits 1 and 0, how do you represent the number 1033? (This was an actual question I remember from a test, which I aced because I already knew binary but most of classmates were dumbfounded by…

>Any question in English to a kid who grew up in a home that didn't speak English.

On english exams (here) the question is written in native language

Re: Google reports soaring attrition among Black women

#433

Post by jedberg » Sun, Jul 04, 2021, 4:35 PM UTC

tester756 wrote: post #432

jedberg wrote: post #421

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Runner is to Marathon as Regatta is to_________________ (You need to be wealthy and coastal to know what a Regatta is) If you have a number system where each place is a power of two greater than the one next to it, and only the digits 1 and 0, how do you represent the number 1033? (This was an actual question I remember from a test, which I aced because I already knew binary but most of classmates were dumbfounded by…

>Any question in English to a kid who grew up in a home that didn't speak English. On english exams (here) the question is written in native language

Ok, so I would do poorly then since I don’t speak the native language.

Re: Google reports soaring attrition among Black women

#434

Post by marcus_holmes » Sun, Jul 04, 2021, 10:33 PM UTC

ceilingcorner wrote: post #148

marcus_holmes wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

they are to me. Is there a problem with being "strange" to someone from a different culture?

The word strange implies otherness and inferiority.

not to me. I love strange things. They challenge my status quo.

Re: Google reports soaring attrition among Black women

#435

Post by marcus_holmes » Sun, Jul 04, 2021, 10:34 PM UTC

gedy wrote: post #273

marcus_holmes wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You assume that all applicants are of equal attainment, ability, and motivation. However, women have to fight an in-built discrimination. While men are more forced into work because our gender role expects it of us. Thus, women who are candidates for promotion are likely to be more motivated and more ambitious than their male counterparts - they've had to fight harder against more obstacles to get to that point. I se…

> while male programmers have had nothing but encouragement I really hate this stereotype as growing up in 80s "liking computers" was this thing only "nerds" liked in my area. Getting called a nerd was not at all positive and a derogatory slur. I loved computers at my own (social) peril.

I get that. But talk to a female colleague about her experience with it. They get not only the "nerd" label but also the whole "choose something that's feminine, no boy wants to marry a girl smarter than him" thing. It's fucked up.

Re: Google reports soaring attrition among Black women

#436

Post by marcus_holmes » Sun, Jul 04, 2021, 10:38 PM UTC

ectopod wrote: post #180

marcus_holmes wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You assume that all applicants are of equal attainment, ability, and motivation. However, women have to fight an in-built discrimination. While men are more forced into work because our gender role expects it of us. Thus, women who are candidates for promotion are likely to be more motivated and more ambitious than their male counterparts - they've had to fight harder against more obstacles to get to that point. I se…

In the UK there is an often-repeated statistic: the 20% of girls who take A-level physics outperform the 40% of boys who take it. And of course they do! It's like saying a team comprised of footballers from the top division will beat a team comprised of footballers from the top two divisions. The few women who go into tech or board rooms or whatever will typically be the women who are good at it, and they will typica…

You're so close! If the majority group and minority group have equal distribution of ability in a subject, why are the minority a minority?

Women are 55% of the population. Why aren't they 55% of tech workers? Why are only the 20% who are really good at it working in tech?

Saying "the minority are always going to be better" doesn't explain why. And the why is really important.

Pro tip: talk to women who would like to work in tech but aren't for an answer.

Re: Google reports soaring attrition among Black women

#437

Post by SuoDuanDao » Mon, Jul 05, 2021, 12:32 PM UTC

3pt14159 wrote: post #265

tasubotadas wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>LGBTTQQIAAP I had to look up if this acronym was some kind of joke.

The dumb thing is we actually have a word for this. The word is queer. I'm still unsure as to why this word isn't used for most contexts where the LGBT[...] are currently used. We use the word "gay" and that used to be an insult like "queer" was too.

I think 'Queer' is one of the Q's. The definition I heard for it now was that 'gay' is someone who wants to have a mainstream life with their same-sex partner while 'queer' is someone who considers their sexual identity a form of rebellion.

Re: Google reports soaring attrition among Black women

#438

Post by 3pt14159 » Mon, Jul 05, 2021, 1:41 PM UTC

SuoDuanDao wrote: post #437

3pt14159 wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The dumb thing is we actually have a word for this. The word is queer. I'm still unsure as to why this word isn't used for most contexts where the LGBT[...] are currently used. We use the word "gay" and that used to be an insult like "queer" was too.

I think 'Queer' is one of the Q's. The definition I heard for it now was that 'gay' is someone who wants to have a mainstream life with their same-sex partner while 'queer' is someone who considers their sexual identity a form of rebellion.

From the first sentence on the Wikipedia article:

> Queer is an umbrella term for sexual and gender minorities who are not heterosexual or are not cisgender.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queer

Now, some people personally identify as queer instead of lesbian, bi, or gay for all sorts of reasons; but it is the umbrella term.

Re: Google reports soaring attrition among Black women

#439

Post by tester756 » Mon, Jul 05, 2021, 8:37 PM UTC

jedberg wrote: post #433

tester756 wrote: post #432

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Any question in English to a kid who grew up in a home that didn't speak English. On english exams (here) the question is written in native language

Ok, so I would do poorly then since I don’t speak the native language.

What do you meaan?

e.g Polish students in Poland take english exams and the "what you have to do" part is written in Polish, but the task itself challenges english skills

Re: Google reports soaring attrition among Black women

#440

Post by jedberg » Mon, Jul 05, 2021, 8:45 PM UTC

tester756 wrote: post #439

jedberg wrote: post #433

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, so I would do poorly then since I don’t speak the native language.

What do you meaan? e.g Polish students in Poland take english exams and the "what you have to do" part is written in Polish, but the task itself challenges english skills

For the math part, are the instructions in Polish or English? As a native English speaker, I would have trouble doing math if the instructions and word problems were in Polish, even if Polish were my second language.

Usually standardized tests are in one language regardless of if you're a native speaker or not, putting immigrants at a disadvantage.