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YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

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Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#431

Post by TillE »

crazygringo wrote: post #73
CivBase wrote: post #37

GitHub is still hosting the full youtube-dl version history, including versions which include those supposedly infringing tests. Does copyright law end with HEAD on master? Those tests are still there. This makes it especially obvious that the RIAA's problem with youtube-dl was never really the tests.

I've always wondered about copyright and HEAD. For example, you can find a LOT of copyrighted font files that were committed somewhere in GitHub, and then removed in a later commit once they realized they'd accidentally uploaded a copyrighted file. But they're still always there in the history, effortless to download. I'm not really sure what to make of that. I don't think it would really count as removal in court...…

A lot of stuff like this is technically infringement but will never be worth anyone's time suing over, except maliciously.

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#432

Post by twodave »

CivBase wrote: post #292

Why did the EFF have to step in here? What did the EFF letter provide that GitHub couldn't have figured out itself? If GitHub really was "standing up for developers", why couldn't Microsoft's own army of lawyers figure this out? If youtube-dl (or any OSS project) continues to use GitHub, I hope they have a backup plan ready at all times. Even if GitHub truly is on the right side, they've proven themselves to be a lia…

> If youtube-dl (or any OSS project) continues to use GitHub, I hope they have a backup plan ready at all times.

I mean, I guess I understand the sentiment here, but really, most projects don't run this risk. Youtube-dl, on the other hand, is used by people to download copyrighted material. It's a natural target, and as a project maintainer/contributor you have to be aware of the legal setting in which your project exists.

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#433

Post by lozaning »

roughly wrote: post #319
schoolornot wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Drug paraphernalia is still a crime in most places. Not sure what the equal to "spice grinder" here is.

I don't know what the laws are on possession, but before marijuana was legalized it was far, far easier to buy a bong than the weed to smoke in it. I'm wracking my brain to try to think of a piece of drug paraphernalia that is illegal to sell or illegal to possess in the absence of the drugs themselves.

In the state I live in it's illegal to to be in possession of any paraphernalia. Thats why you cant buy a bong anywhere, but can buy a water pipe at every corner store headshop.

That being said it's a petty misdemeanor that does not result in any jail time until your third infraction.

https://www.revisor.mn.gov/statutes/cite/152.092

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#434

Post by soulofmischief »

tpl wrote: post #383

Github did not stand up for developers here at all. It is wonderful that in the future they might, but it seems to me like they missed/have been missing a chance to really stand up for devs. The DMCA is being used far too often for abusive aims for my tastes and I hope that some reform is around the corner (Maybe more real incentives to not file false claims).

Nat Friedman, Github's CEO, personally joined the #youtube-dl IRC channel and initiated working towards the reinstatement of the project.

If the CEO personally taking a stand and working against this DMCA request, if the fact that all DMCA requests are publicly archived, if the fact that youtube-dl is already back up, do not convince you that GitHub had the right motives here, I don't know what to tell you.

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#435

Post by bredren »

It is important to recognize when a person or organization takes corrective action.

Between this and Apple’s response regarding the app signature, these are examples of companies seeing problems and taking steps to fix them.

It is okay to want more or see how it could be an even better response. But the fact that a credible response was executed on should be praised.

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#436

Post by leafmeal »

They plan to audit all of the take-down requests which is awesome, and it's more than required by law.

I wonder if they'll regret this move. They're shielding developers, but taking the burden on themselves of managing the legal hassle of take-down requests.

As other commenters have pointed out, it sounds like the real problem is that copyright holders can issue these requests without any limit (or maybe even due diligence).

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#437

Post by thebean11 »

LeoNatan25 wrote: post #397
wgjordan wrote: post #367

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If GitHub really was "standing up for developers", why couldn't Microsoft's own army of lawyers figure this out? I think the 'What we're changing' section is the real interesting part of this post regarding this. I read this section as a half-apology for not doing enough to stand up for developers in this case (allowing the repository to be taken down to begin with), and a promise to do more in the future to preven…

So ... they didn't stand up for developers? Promise is not "standing up for".

Did you read the new policies? It sounds like in the future it will be way more difficult to get repos taken down with DMCAs, and even for legitimate ones they'll allow devs to respond or fix the repo before it gets removed.

Maybe GitHub didn't nail it this time but in my opinion it takes some mental gymnastics to not see this post as a really positive turn from GH.

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#438

Post by charlesdaniels »

I think it is important to note that GitHub's parent company[1] Microsoft is a member of the RIAA[0], the group who initially filed this DMCA.

The cynic in me says this was deliberately pre-planned to garnet free press. That type of behavior would certainly be in-line for the company responsible for the Halloween Documents[2][3].

Even if we give GitHub, and by extension Microsoft the benefit of the doubt here, this is a lesson we should not soon forget: Microsoft will not go to bat for you, not unless you can wield the power of the HN/Reddit/Twitter/etc outrage machine to create a PR problem for them.

Don't rely on Microsoft to be the centralized underpinnings of the open source world. At worst, it paves the way for EEE[4] 2.0. At best, it creates a single centralized target for malicious actors, such as the RIAA.

0 - https://www.riaa.com/about-riaa/riaa-members/

1 - https://blogs.microsoft.com/blog/2018/10/26/microsoft-comple...

2 - http://www.catb.org/~esr/halloween/

3 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halloween_documents

4 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Embrace,_extend,_and_extinguis...

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#439

Post by TechBro8615 »

TheKarateKid wrote: post #354
Rochus wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't believe that Github actually needed the EFF's writing for this, or that they don't have the necessary technical expertise themselves. That is probably rather a protective assertion not to lose face. But at least they seem to have learned something from it now and want to review such requests technically before they (unjustifiably) act.

This. Github is acting like the knight in shining armor, but they really didn't do anything except respond to the backlash their complicit no-questions-asked removal caused.

On the contrary, they’re doing a lot, including establishing a $1M legal defense fund for developers and a technical team to review the validity of anti-circumvention DMCA notices. It seems like they’re doing a lot more than just paying lip service to EFF / developer freedom, and they should be commended for it.

Re: YouTube-dl's repository has been restored

#440

Post by bergstromm466 »

disown wrote: post #258
toomuchtodo wrote: post #159

Say what you will about Github and Microsoft, this was a classy move. A million dollars is a million dollars. "Putting your money where your mouth is". "Nonetheless, developers who want to push back against unwarranted takedowns may face the risk of taking on personal liability and legal defense costs. To help them, GitHub will establish and donate $1M to a developer defense fund to help protect open source developer…

> A million dollars is a million dollars. Not if you are a company worth $1.6 trillion dollars. But that $1 million dollars probably bought them a lot more in free press. To put it into perspective, it would be like someone worth $1.6 million giving a homeless person $1, filming it, putting it on youtube and profiting off of it. > Thanks Microsoft/Github. Is this real? Edit: Of course the downvotes. Not sure if emplo…

> Is this real?

I'm as amazed as you are.

> The "love" for microsoft recently is interesting.

The Corporatocracy has never been so polarizing.

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