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iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

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Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#431

Post by thisisastopsign »

deergomoo wrote: post #303
jeffparsons wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For some reason I still strongly prefer the look and feel of Android over iOS, but at this point my next phone will be an iPhone. Why? Because Google recently stepped up its notification spam in their official apps. They're using a mechanism that's supposed to exist to notify me of things _I_ want/need to know about urgently instead to advertise products and services to me that I have no interest in. It's tedious to…

> I paid a premium for a high-end flagship Google phone Unfortunately it seems paying a premium isn't enough to get any respect from manufacturers these days. Just look at Samsung and LG TVs, you can pay thousands for a high-end model and still have to set up PiHole to avoid being shown ads in the menus.

I plugged another device into my TV and use that for media streaming. I’ve never connected my TV to my network and haven’t had any issue

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#432

Post by hyperbovine »

ogre_codes wrote: post #96
hyperbovine wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course they have a choice: charge money for the services they provide. Revolutionary concept, I know.

Charge for search? For maps? Gmail? How's that going to work when you get it for free from everyone else? The entire reason Google's products are as big/ successful as they are is because they are free. If they started charging for Gmail, the rush to the exits would be instant. If Google started charging for Android OEMs would switch to AOSP, China, Amazon, and Microsoft would ensure a supply of free Android versions…

I can't get maps or gmail for free from somewhere else. Maps is far and away the best in class, and I've got close to two decades worth of lock-in on their mail platform. And we haven't even mentioned the elephant in the room which is search. I'd pay them a seriously nontrivial amount of money each year if they bundled those services into a single privacy-aware offering. Way more than they're making off me from the ads I block and ignore.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#433

Post by parrots »

jvzr wrote: post #288
jeffparsons wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For some reason I still strongly prefer the look and feel of Android over iOS, but at this point my next phone will be an iPhone. Why? Because Google recently stepped up its notification spam in their official apps. They're using a mechanism that's supposed to exist to notify me of things _I_ want/need to know about urgently instead to advertise products and services to me that I have no interest in. It's tedious to…

Just a heads up: Apple in their guidelines tell developers not to do that, and yet they do send some notifications advertising their products and/or services sometimes (recently for Apple TV+). They also do not police developers' notifications, so some developers abuse it. Just an example: I love Slopes and its lone developer deserves all the praise, and yet a week ago I've received an unwarranted ad for the paid sub…

Hi, developer of Slopes here. Wait, what!? I do not use push for marketing (I hardly have a working push server). I haven't ever sent out any push notification for any reason (the recording reminders are local notifications, not server-side ones).

I do have a little in-app banner at the top of the logbook screen for messaging like prompting to create an account, or upselling premium, or other things. It has grey background, but its buttons are blue and it has a red dot on it so it doesn't look to clone the appearance of a system notification perfectly or anything (it isn't even pinned to the top of the screen or anything, where notifications come from). Maybe you thought it was a notification? But it can only occur in-app, on one screen, and is in no way a violation of Apple's ToS.

Edit: Screenshot of the in-app banner to aid discussion: https://www.dropbox.com/s/i3ib5pbfg5eid51/Screen%20Shot%2020...

Edit 2: The banner used to be all blue, which looked even less like a system notification, but I was worried it was too distracting from users' content so this season I opted for a grey background to help it blend in more.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#434

Post by heavyset_go »

abeyer wrote: post #250
heavyset_go wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apps can detect this, and some apps will ban you if you mock your location.

Wait, they'll ban me from their privacy-invading malvertising? Where do I sign up?

Some location-based dating apps will do this.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#435

Post by parrots »

jvzr wrote: post #418
fluffything wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I love Slopes and its lone developer deserves all the praise, and yet a week ago I've received an unwarranted ad for the paid subscription disguised as a notification... Not cool. You just need to notify Apple that a particular App in the store violates their ToS. I've done this before, and in a matter of a few days, the App is removed from the store, and the other apps of that dev are scanned for ToS violations. T…

I do not wish that upon any developer, especially small indie shops. So I'd probably do as you suggest. However, I would also very much like Apple to lead by example and stop spamming its paying customers (anyone that bought an iOS or Mac product) with marketing notifications...

I'm really hoping Apple keeps a log of pushes, because they'll happily be able to tell you that the only pushes I send with Slopes are silent content-available notification for sync engine stuff. I have never sent any user-visible notification, and you're likely mistaking an in-app call-to-action as a push notification.

Apps that use push for marketing deserve hellfire, even if they are little indie shops. Being indie is no excuse for abusing things like push. We have to be scrappy, but we can do so without being spammy.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#436

Post by SlowRobotAhead »

htfu wrote: post #239
SlowRobotAhead wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't disagree. They need to do have a consistent approach. Selective enforcement is not likely the thing here, it seems like sibling that this just got missed. So, report to Apple, file a review, stop using it. If Apple comes to the rescue and characteristically fixes it, great, if they don't - they've already made great steps in allowing you to make informed decisions.

Why stop using the app, let one report it, and not just turn the unwanted feature off? And I think the app is covered since it's saying "enabling location data means you can plot on a map where you've connected to a host" or something like that in settings - good enough a bs feature for Apple to let it slide, evidently.

> Why stop using the app

Because they have clearly demonstrated they do not deserve your trust or support.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#437

Post by jredwards »

dpkonofa wrote: post #6

My favorite thing about these features is the number of apps that it’s reminded me to uninstall completely from my devices. The number of apps that I initially installed months ago that didn’t have any of this that suddenly developed tracking notifications is staggering. I never would have known either since the updates happen silently in the background. Great features.

I love this feature.

I regularly go through and turn off location tracking on almost all of my apps (or at least turn them to 'while using'). But sometimes I'll have to turn them back to permanent for a specific reason (e.g. sharing my location with someone while I'm coordinating with them). This feature reminds me to turn it back off.

But I also potentially see the need for a feature which allows always-on access for a limited period of time.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#438

Post by busymom0 »

yoz-y wrote: post #381
busymom0 wrote: post #358

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have emailed a developer in the past and they apologized and as far as I remember, I haven't had that issue since then. So I think it depends upon each developer.

For small apps it is possible I guess. Problem is that many large companies use this practice. I've tried to reason with The Fork and the French rail company to no avail for example. They know they don't risk anything by violating this rule and Apple has no high ground as they violate this same rule themselves.

That's fair. The one I emailed was a solo developer I believe. I think if enough people make noise about it (make a post on such apps abusing the system on /r/apple) and then send it to Apple, they will take action.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#439

Post by Polylactic_acid »

Accacin wrote: post #317
Polylactic_acid wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Without sideloading I can't use a 3rd party youtube app that has no ads, no tracking and allows downloads. I also can't use my pebble watch because the official app is unsupported and only community supported software exists. I also am restricted from some content that android users of the same app can view because apple prohibits adult content inside of apps. I see a phone as a tool to do what the user needs. Not th…

> I can't use a 3rd party youtube app that has no ads, no tracking and allows downloads. It's called YouTube Premium. It's funny how we Hacker News users complain about services like YouTube and say we'd pay, but very few do.

I'm not complaining. I have a setup that works well for me. It just isn't possible on iOS.

Re: iOS 13 app tracking alert has dramatically cut location data flow to ad industry

#440

Post by rpastuszak »

ericmay wrote: post #428
rpastuszak wrote: post #353

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Google has the same thing, and with apple if you care you can opt out. I'm not on Android any more, but (afair) you could reset the advertising ID, which in practice is not that different from only being able to disable it temporarily.

Yes, but the ease of use and prominence of the feature make a difference. If I have to manually reset the ID, well, forget it. If the operating system automatically does it for me - then that is far superior.

Oh, yes. That’s what I meant and tried to express, poorly.

The UX makes a huge difference here, a feature is available in theory, but realistically speaking, inaccessible and annoying to the point of uselessness.

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