Things Many People Find Too Obvious to Have Told You Already • Hacker News Board

Re: Things Many People Find Too Obvious to Have Told You Already

#431

Post by _wp3r » Sat, Dec 02, 2017, 3:01 PM UTC

virgilp wrote: post #388

rhaps0dy wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you framed your anecdotal evidence as supporting the OP's statement, but also that you misunderstood such statement; and you actually present evidence against it. If companies find it hard to reliably staff generalist positions, _and_ you're a generalist as you claim, then you would find it _easy_ to get a job.

It's strange, but I think at least some companies find it hard to staff positions, while also at the same time ignoring/rejecting suitable candidates. Case in point - I'm a generalist who can very credibly claim very significant expertise at two disconnected areas (compilers and distributed systems), plus some startup/ product management expertise. I saw a job listing here for a startup that needed both of these and…

I would bet my lunch that your scenario was a keyword mismatch. Always keep in mind that the "hiring person" at startups is usually the non-technical person. So you have to get past the skills list provided by the CTO/CIO/Lead Dev.

I have seen three approaches to limit this. First being to stay super field specific but implementation general, but not keyword void. Second, is to go super rabbit hole on every keyword/tool/language/platform you have ever worked with inside the field.

The third approach is to have a type one resume with a type two cover letter. That approach has usually been the most consistent for callbacks in my circles, and allows for your rabbit hole to be of the same type as the job description.

Re: Things Many People Find Too Obvious to Have Told You Already

#432

Post by nickthemagicman » Sat, Dec 02, 2017, 3:03 PM UTC

reedlaw wrote: post #429

blurbleblurble wrote: post #73

> Companies find it incredibly hard to reliably staff positions with hard-working generalists who operate autonomously and have high risk tolerances. This is not the modal employee, including at places which are justifiably proud of the skill/diligence/etc of their employees. This one. Every job I see when I go looking is 40+ hrs a week, likely with plenty of idle time and projects I don't believe in. Part of this is…

I'm not sure what he meant by "modal employee". Is it in the statistical sense of occuring most frequently?

Looking at it, I think he means the statistical middle employee.

Re: Things Many People Find Too Obvious to Have Told You Already

#433

Post by nickthemagicman » Sat, Dec 02, 2017, 3:04 PM UTC

Your idea is not valuable, at all. All value is in the execution. You think you are an exception; you are not. You should not insist on an NDA to talk about it; nobody serious will engage in contract review over an idea, and this will mark you as clueless.

Love that so much.

Re: Things Many People Find Too Obvious to Have Told You Already

#434

Post by reactorofr » Sat, Dec 02, 2017, 3:07 PM UTC

reedlaw wrote: post #429

blurbleblurble wrote: post #73

> Companies find it incredibly hard to reliably staff positions with hard-working generalists who operate autonomously and have high risk tolerances. This is not the modal employee, including at places which are justifiably proud of the skill/diligence/etc of their employees. This one. Every job I see when I go looking is 40+ hrs a week, likely with plenty of idle time and projects I don't believe in. Part of this is…

I'm not sure what he meant by "modal employee". Is it in the statistical sense of occuring most frequently?

I think that's exactly what he meant.

Re: Things Many People Find Too Obvious to Have Told You Already

#435

Post by virgilp » Sat, Dec 02, 2017, 3:15 PM UTC

_wp3r wrote: post #431

virgilp wrote: post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's strange, but I think at least some companies find it hard to staff positions, while also at the same time ignoring/rejecting suitable candidates. Case in point - I'm a generalist who can very credibly claim very significant expertise at two disconnected areas (compilers and distributed systems), plus some startup/ product management expertise. I saw a job listing here for a startup that needed both of these and…

I would bet my lunch that your scenario was a keyword mismatch. Always keep in mind that the "hiring person" at startups is usually the non-technical person. So you have to get past the skills list provided by the CTO/CIO/Lead Dev. I have seen three approaches to limit this. First being to stay super field specific but implementation general, but not keyword void. Second, is to go super rabbit hole on every keyword/t…

You might be right (though there may be other explanations, e.g. ageism or just wanting local employees, and writing "remote" just for the heck of it, "to get more leads"). But even if you're right, that just reinforces my point: I'm not desperate to get a job; I wrote to have a discussion, because they managed to pique my interest... I didn't put any kind of effort to "market" myself, thought they'll figure things out in the interview(s). They were basically fortunate that their advertising hit he right target. And what did they do with that lead that they got? They throw it away through a non-technical filter....

Re: Things Many People Find Too Obvious to Have Told You Already

#436

Post by badpun » Sat, Dec 02, 2017, 3:32 PM UTC

emodendroket wrote: post #403

badpun wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My impression is that coding requires more energy and enthusiasm (so, in other words, internal motivation) to do a good job than many other professions. Hence 5 year exp "senior" can do a better job than a jaded and complacent 15 year exp one.

I don't know about that. Surely expertise can make up for "energy and enthusiasm" (even after decades nobody knows everything about programming). It sounds a little like a post hoc justification of age discrimination.

In my impression, people who have been coding for 5 years already have plenty of experience, esp. if they are enthusiastic about learning. They may not be team lead material yet, but they should make a fine individual contributor.

Re: Things Many People Find Too Obvious to Have Told You Already

#437

Post by Singletoned » Sat, Dec 02, 2017, 3:32 PM UTC

> Technical literacy in the broader population can be approximated with the Thanksgiving test: what sort of questions do you get at Thanksgiving? That's the ambient level of literacy.

I didn't understand this one (perhaps due to not being American). Can someone explain it please?

Re: Things Many People Find Too Obvious to Have Told You Already

#438

Post by blurbleblurble » Sat, Dec 02, 2017, 3:38 PM UTC

_wp3r wrote: post #424

blurbleblurble wrote: post #73

> Companies find it incredibly hard to reliably staff positions with hard-working generalists who operate autonomously and have high risk tolerances. This is not the modal employee, including at places which are justifiably proud of the skill/diligence/etc of their employees. This one. Every job I see when I go looking is 40+ hrs a week, likely with plenty of idle time and projects I don't believe in. Part of this is…

It would rarely be effective to market yourself as a generalist on paper. If you have 3 primary skill sets you should have 3 focused resumes. If you want a position that requires a generalist, the only/best fit would be founder. In almost all other circumstances, companies hire for a problem and not general optimizations. Even if they need a generalist. I would posit that you have a marketing problem and not a skills…

Thanks for your insight. It really resonates with me.

I think you're very right about my marketing problem :)

On the surface, my website is kinda out there. I built it from the ground up using Rake and some gems as a static site generator. I think it's very cool, and I don't expect that many people will appreciate it, but I'm hoping that one day someone comes along and says "wow, that's pretty cool, wanna help us with this Ruby thing?")

In a deeper way, this whole discussion is very helpful... it's giving me a fresh perspective on how to frame conversations with future potential employers.

And actually the other day I had an epiphany about my marketing. Sure, I chose an odd path, but I've already done so much of the work! I just need to get my random little open source tools in decent, usable shape so that people who'd find them useful might actually get a chance to use them. I need to get my half done work finished and make tutorials about it and get myself out there.

This came after I got a call from a contracting company who told me they were bidding on an interesting job that might be a good fit for me... I was so excited that I stayed up all night and finished like three old random projects at the same time, just so I could put more stuff on my portfolio. It was a wakeup call, affirming that there actually just might be some cool work out there after all... so get your shit together!

Re: Things Many People Find Too Obvious to Have Told You Already

#439

Post by oconnor663 » Sat, Dec 02, 2017, 3:39 PM UTC

Singletoned wrote: post #437

> Technical literacy in the broader population can be approximated with the Thanksgiving test: what sort of questions do you get at Thanksgiving? That's the ambient level of literacy. I didn't understand this one (perhaps due to not being American). Can someone explain it please?

Thanksgiving is a holiday where many people have a big family meal. If you have family members who you usually only see once a year, there's a good chance that day is Thanksgiving. So that's when a lot of people tend to field questions from people who 1) care about them enough to ask how their new job is going but 2) have no idea what they really do at work.

Re: Things Many People Find Too Obvious to Have Told You Already

#440

Post by blurbleblurble » Sat, Dec 02, 2017, 3:51 PM UTC

maroonblazer wrote: post #416

dmichulke wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same here, I work independently for a few years now and it just becomes less interesting, and for interesting problems where you'd learn something new (I.e. where you are not good but you know you'd get there quickly) you cannot maintain your rate. I keep wondering if I should take the rate cut for a year or just study mathematics at the local university (which is free here) ...

Genuinely curious: how would studying maths solve your specialist/generalist dilemma?

Math is multidisciplinary like none other. You could use graph theory, for example, to study relationships in music, sociology, chemical reactions, transportation systems, markets, ecosystems, whatever. And the insight you gain in applying it from one angle will almost certainly provide a fresh light when you pivot back to a different application.

Having a math PhD could also help cut through the bs of people thinking you're not useful because you're a generalist. Suddenly, they'd be asking you to help them with weird little problems. Which is what I'm pretty good at like to do!