This article separately needs a summary at top.
Not everything needs to be summarised
Pulling a straw man, eh? I didn't say that everything needed to to be summarised. But this article definitely does.
What Apple and Google are doing to push notifications
421–428 of 428 posts
Re: What Apple and Google are doing to push notifications
#422Earlier quoted context omitted.
I mean, it's kind of an insurmountable obstacle. Why bother trying to unsubscribe when you're always gonna get spam anyway? It's just gonna come back. Also, websites are shady. If you put in a required email, they'll usually automatically check a little box for you that says "allow us to ruin your inbox?" How helpful of them. And, I'm not even convinced that checkbox does anything.
I realise that CANSPAM as a law in the US is titled appropriately but I live in the UK where declarative opt-in is a must apart from a couple “soft” opt-in scenarios. People. Opt. In. Stop conflating your preferences with other people’s.
Ah yes, the law. Famously followed by every party, especially on the internet.
Riddle me this, if a shady company not even headquartered in the UK sends you a newsletter you didn’t willingly opt in to, what happens to them?
Re: What Apple and Google are doing to push notifications
#423Earlier quoted context omitted.
> From my perspective, the more roadblocks the platforms put between unnecessary notifications and my phone, the better. I know lots of apps behave badly when it comes to notifications but I'd still prefer if the apps controlled the level of notifications they sent. I could, of course, reduce that client-side, but I don't see why I'd want Google or Apple or any other intermediary see or control the notifications. If…
This forces millions of users to individually monitor and fix dozens or hundreds of apps all the time - something most don't have time for and leads to an awful experience. Centralized controls are better for the user.
Centralized controls are better if we assume the user is either technologically dumb (or uneducated, or naive, if you prefer other terms) or strapped for time.
Current users might be just that. I agree. But those same users decided to download dozens of hundreds of apps. They use each app much more than it would take for them to go to the settings (if such good settings exist) and take care of what is allowed and what isn't. It's their responsibility.
We've let users be treated as infants far too long. That leads to centralized decisions on behalf of these users, for their own good. Which leads to users being more and more negligent in their duty to govern their own digital selves. It's a vicious cycle.
Can we break it just by changing the way users manage their notifications? Likely no, sadly. We need a complete overhaul of personal digital responsibility. We need to remove (almost?) all safeguards and nanny-state (nanny-corp?) treatments the users get. Let them get hacked, let them lose money, let their digital lives, money, identities completely go to shit. They will recover but they'll have learned a valuable lesson - the computer in their pockets is their own computer, the apps they install could be malicious, the consequences are not artificially removed. I think the users will learn after a a while.
We don't install guards to prevent someone from poking into the outlets with a fork. We do it for small children. We don't put guardrails everywhere. If you're not careful where you go, you might fall or get hit by a car. Why is the digital realm so different? We've had computers for a while now, it's time to take responsibility for ourselves.
Otherwise we'll always treat users as infants or sheep or retards or whatever you wanna call it. That means making our safety and security someone else's problem, but that also means letting go of any agency we have. Letting others control our lives. And our digital lives are becoming a bigger part of our lives as times goes on.
I upvoted your comment, btw. You are right that now centralized solutions are better, but later that might change and we'll have no recourse. "We" as a people, not individuals.
Re: What Apple and Google are doing to push notifications
#424Earlier quoted context omitted.
> From my perspective, the more roadblocks the platforms put between unnecessary notifications and my phone, the better. I know lots of apps behave badly when it comes to notifications but I'd still prefer if the apps controlled the level of notifications they sent. I could, of course, reduce that client-side, but I don't see why I'd want Google or Apple or any other intermediary see or control the notifications. If…
TFA discusses at-length how APNs and FCM are necessary intermediaries regardless, effectively creating a technical duopoly on 'push'. We all agree it would've been preferable for things not to have gotten this way, but here we are.
Here we are, but let's think of ways to change it. I hope that even if some people start thinking differently, in terms of changing the status quo, we could reach a better future.
Re: What Apple and Google are doing to push notifications
#425Earlier quoted context omitted.
Some providers (looking at you, Intuit) don't seem to understand TWO factor authentication and will allow someone to bypass your password if they can intercept the SMS or email, and treat it as a normal login.
I can imagine an evolution like: 1. Introduce passwords 2. Introduce email-based reset flow 3. Introduce 2FA (optional) 4. Someone says "take the password reset flow, trigger it automatically when a user tries to log in and has only given their email, hide the password field during login, and after the email is validated drop the user back to their previous journey instead of having them set a new password" 5. You se…
It's Intuit's normal login flow. Enter username and it then says enter password or click here and we'll text/e-mail you a code. Ironically, if you use a password it will often text you a 2FA code.
Re: What Apple and Google are doing to push notifications
#426Earlier quoted context omitted.
This forces millions of users to individually monitor and fix dozens or hundreds of apps all the time - something most don't have time for and leads to an awful experience. Centralized controls are better for the user.
Centralized controls are better if we assume the user is either technologically dumb (or uneducated, or naive, if you prefer other terms) or strapped for time. Current users might be just that. I agree. But those same users decided to download dozens of hundreds of apps. They use each app much more than it would take for them to go to the settings (if such good settings exist) and take care of what is allowed and wha…
> We don't install guards to prevent someone from poking into the outlets with a fork.
We absolutely do, and they've been mandatory for a while. https://www.electricallicenserenewal.com/Electrical-Continui...
Re: What Apple and Google are doing to push notifications
#427Earlier quoted context omitted.
Centralized controls are better if we assume the user is either technologically dumb (or uneducated, or naive, if you prefer other terms) or strapped for time. Current users might be just that. I agree. But those same users decided to download dozens of hundreds of apps. They use each app much more than it would take for them to go to the settings (if such good settings exist) and take care of what is allowed and wha…
> We don't install guards to prevent someone from poking into the outlets with a fork. We absolutely do, and they've been mandatory for a while. https://www.electricallicenserenewal.com/Electrical-Continui...
Except for schools or where kids are likely to be like hotels it's a nanny state solution that forces unnecessary spending, unnecessary licenses and inspections and, most of all, people being told how to lead their lives.
Unrelated to that specific regulation, the US National Electric Code is made by a non-profit who, until 2016, didn't even make copies of the code freely available. That's crazy to me. What's also crazy is how the 2023 version I checked just now has 918 pages of dense regulations. Am I really supposed to believe all that is necessary?
Re: What Apple and Google are doing to push notifications
#428apple can’t even make a working alarm clock on a smartphone
Mine works, what are you talking about?
1000s of people have their alarm on ios go off completely silent daily. mine did it 6 days in a week before i got a physical alarm clock. and yes, all the usual settings are correct. more H1Bs please!