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Google Declaring War on the Web

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Re: Google Declaring War on the Web

#421

Post by Gormo »

the_snooze wrote: post #138
kQq9oHeAz6wLLS wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We're going back to the CompuServe/AOL/Prodigy model

We're going back to the mainframe model. Client-side general-purpose computing is an impediment to recurring subscription revenue and vendor lock-in.

The mainframe model fell apart the moment that microcomputers became powerful enough to satisfy same use cases sufficiently. Centralized GenAI will also become obsolete as soon as local LLMs are capable enough to satisfy the same use cases sufficiently.

Artificial lock-in simply doesn't work in the long run: the incentive structures will always motivate customers to cut out middlemen, and peripheral markets to develop around providing the tools for doing exactly that. Anthropic and OpenAI may well end up being the Data General and Honeywell of our era.

The greatest risk to this is the possibility of political intervention creating artificial hurdles that prevents decentralized AI from challenging the big players. With than in mind, it's worthwhile to subject every proposal to regulate AI to intense scrutiny.

Re: Google Declaring War on the Web

#422

Post by pembrook »

46493168 wrote: post #420
pembrook wrote: post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, the craft to mass production pipeline (democratization) is frustrating for the individual craftsman, as has been true for hundreds of years. AI is simply the assembly line for the digital realm. It takes the trendy products of the rich (custom software, McKinsey PowerPoint decks, etc) and mass produces them in the same style so everyone can afford to buy them at Walmart. For things where the exclusivity WAS the…

>I don’t see any of the AI protestors here exclusively wearing hand-loomed fabrics and bespoke clothing and $5,000 cobbler-pounded leather boots while typing angrily on their keyboards. I also don’t see anyone commissioning artisan chair makers and blacksmiths to create $10,000+ custom furniture to sit on while posting pessimistic comments to HN. We can’t afford those things…

Yes, that's my point.

Before mass production only the aristocrats and royalty could own a closet full of clothing and shoes.

If we blocked the creation of the assembly line and factories, we would return to that state where everyone is basically a subsistence farmer living in the dirt with nothing.

Re: Google Declaring War on the Web

#423

Post by WarmWash »

truthbe wrote: post #292
WarmWash wrote: post #154

Google made an egalitarian web, where money doesn't matter and attention does. A currency that everyone on Earth richest to poorest has a roughly equal amount of. I think almost everyone takes that for granted, and focuses purely on the negatives (you're not paying, therefore you are the product, kept in place by bait we call services) On the flip side, and I'm all for it, we can go to everything paywalled. The downs…

> Google made an egalitarian web, where money doesn't matter and attention does. They did? Could have sworn their whole business model up until the other day was attention for whomever can pay the highest bid for their ad space.. I guess I've been doing it wrong

Any person on earth with internet can use google's standard suite of products with no money necessary. I'm not aware of any other company that did it before them, on the scale that they did it. That is straight out of the progressive book of a utopian future. No money, equal access.

It's not egalitarian for advertisers, they need to pay money and compete. So Google is structered where megacorps pay the money to cover costs of the services you use, rather than you needing to come up with the money. This system made google available to every person on earth with an internet connection, billionaire rich or $2/day poor, you were using the same Maps, same Sheets, same Youtube, same Search, etc.

This isn't a defense of the system, frankly now I wish it was paid, even if that means 6 billions people who had accounts can no longer afford them. It's a recognition of the system for what it is, not what people who never really thought about it or understood it think it is.

Also, a side note, Facebook followed right behind Google with this model.

Re: Google Declaring War on the Web

#424

Post by oort-cloud9 »

analogpixel wrote: post #29

I feel like AI has gotten to the point where the message is: If you want to make something (art/code/music/writing) you can do it for your own enjoyment, but you aren't allowed to make money from it anymore; only the large corporations can make money from content. If you do release something creative, it'll just be fed back into the machine to be copied over and over.

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Re: Google Declaring War on the Web

#425

Post by oort-cloud9 »

Eyeland0 wrote: post #303
analogpixel wrote: post #29

I feel like AI has gotten to the point where the message is: If you want to make something (art/code/music/writing) you can do it for your own enjoyment, but you aren't allowed to make money from it anymore; only the large corporations can make money from content. If you do release something creative, it'll just be fed back into the machine to be copied over and over.

"And what does the money machine eat to shit it out? It eats youth, spontaneity, life, beauty and above all it eats creativity. It eats quality and shits out quantity." -William S. Burroughs

[dead]

Re: Google Declaring War on the Web

#426

Post by newaccountman2 »

marcus_holmes wrote: post #340
newaccountman2 wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But I hate Ikea furniture - it's made of shitty, flimsy, materials, and its design priorities are all based on cost and ease of transport, not on being great furniture that will last years and be an actual asset to the home. I have seen/heard this a lot lately, but all the Ikea furniture I have ever had has been great. Among others, had a chair that was good for like 11 years lol

I think this is actually a counter-example of what you think it is. Chairs should last generations. A chair lasting 11 years is not exemplary. A chair falling apart after a few years should be the exception, and a bad thing at that. Again, Vimes Theory: rich folks inherit furniture that their grandparents bought, and maybe need to get it re-upholstered once in their lifetime. Poor folks have to pay for new furniture…

> Chairs should last generations. A chair lasting 11 years is not exemplary. A chair falling apart after a few years should be the exception, and a bad thing at that.

IDK, this feels to me more like an aspiration or desire about what furniture quality should generally be, and not really a description of what most furniture is actually like.

> rich folks inherit furniture that their grandparents bought, and maybe need to get it re-upholstered once in their lifetime.

I get that this is beside the point, but IDK why anyone would want their grandparents' furniture, aside from maybe a few choice really nice, antique-ish things. If I was "rich", I would rather buy my own furniture for the most part...

Re: Google Declaring War on the Web

#427

Post by nunez »

lelanthran wrote: post #355
acdha wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think there’s also a lot of people who haven’t quite realized what side they’re on. A ton of techies confused better than average pay with being part of the upper class and didn’t realize that the average CEO/VC views us roughly the same as the janitors except more expensive and less reliable. If you’re currently working at a stable tech job, it’s easy to focus on the cool things you can do and ignore how hungry th…

> I think there’s also a lot of people who haven’t quite realized what side they’re on. A ton of techies confused better than average pay with being part of the upper class and didn’t realize that the average CEO/VC views us roughly the same as the janitors except more expensive and less reliable. For all those coders who claim "coding is the smallest part of s/ware dev", they're in for a rude awakening when they rea…

Exactly what I keep saying. Yet, the reply every time is "my job is to solve problems, not write code."

Ok, bud; sure.

I didn't start my professional career as a BA 20 years ago that did exactly what most devs are being "gently forced" into doing now, but whatever.

Re: Google Declaring War on the Web

#428

Post by nunez »

tencentshill wrote: post #418
nunez wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm almost certain there is biblical-level astroturfing happening to make camp (1) much bigger than it really is. Otherwise, Schmidt wouldn't have drowned in a sea of boos at his commencement speech at UA.

That was literally coordinated action. They distributed fliers at the event, and it was mostly due to his sexual assault allegations. https://www.thedailybeast.com/ex-google-ceo-eric-schmidt-boo...

so why did the boos grow loudest every time he mentioned how AI is the future?

and why did that real estate lady who gave a speech at UCF get the same treatment whenever she (also) said that AI is the future?

Re: Google Declaring War on the Web

#430

Post by butz »

Good news, now there is a HUGE space in "classic" web search market. Let google do google things, and if they ever will try to come back, there will be large competition of various sizes.
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