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The time I didn't meet Jeffrey Epstein

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Re: The time I didn't meet Jeffrey Epstein

#421

Post by atoav »

derektank wrote: post #361
atoav wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well why not both? It is certainly true that power attracts those who seek to abuse it. But it is also true that a good fraction of those who are demonstrably corrupt started out way more idealistic.

Is it demonstrably true? Or do people just start out with zero record, making them appear more idealistic/allowing them to adopt more idealistic rhetoric without accusations of hypocrisy?

Well it isn't as if we don't have historical evidence on thousands of political leaders including private diaries etc. Robespierre, Lenin, Mao Zedong, Castro, Napoleon to name only some of the very high profile ones.

Not that there is any specific number we can attach to this, but yes, there are actual idealists who then abused their powers and we know that because there is ample historical evidence of it.

On top of that I know some people personally who were part of the 68 student movement who also have been true idealists in their youth, but since them became defenders of their own order.

Re: The time I didn't meet Jeffrey Epstein

#422

Post by sdellis »

whatever1 wrote: post #150

Power corrupts, end of story. Democracy (limited terms), taxation and anti-monopoly regulation are examples that show a path to cure the disease. Nobody should be trusted with too much power for too long.

We can see that the two-party democracy in the United States has been one of the primary power tools of the 1%. They buy politicians from both parties and then sit back and laugh on their yachts while everyone else goes red in the face, outraged, arguing, and distracted. We are indeed the suckers yet again, but maybe, just maybe this time will be different?

Re: The time I didn't meet Jeffrey Epstein

#423

Post by tzs »

> Last night, I was taken aback to discover that my name appears in the Epstein Files, in 26 different documents

I'm kind of disappointed that my name is not in there. (Well the name is in there but not as my name. When you have a last name that has been in the top 5 in the US for over 230 years and a first name that was top 20 when people in the age group most likely to be in those files were born, you get a lot of false positives).

The bar to ending up in those files for perfectly innocent reasons is pretty low. Epstein was involved in a lot of legitimate things, probably to draw attention away from the illegitimate things.

Do some interesting research that gets some attention in the popular science press and Epstein might want to talk about funding you. Write an interesting book or article that comes to his attention and he might mention it in an email. Heck, write an interesting answer on Quora and you might end up in the files, because Epstein was subscribed to Quora's digest email.

If even 5% of what 15 year old tzs planned to accomplish with his life had happened, I'd be in there in at least one of those innocent ways. It highlights how mundane my life turned out.

Re: The time I didn't meet Jeffrey Epstein

#424

Post by nec4b »

nicoburns wrote: post #385
alphazard wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think they mean "taxation of the too rich" in that case. Everyone wants taxes to go up on everyone making more than them, and for their own taxes to go down. The problem is this is a collective negotiation, not a discussion about what to ask the genie for when we rub the lamp. If the middle class wants to decrease their own taxes (which is the political issue that objectively affects them the most, and how they l…

> Everyone wants taxes to go up on everyone making more than them, and for their own taxes to go down. That's not true at all. I make a good salary as a software engineer, I absolutely think I ought to be taxed a little more than I am, and would gladly pay that money to live in the better society I believe that would create. I believe this attitude is pretty common in many parts of the world. That being said, I do th…

Here you go: https://www.gov.uk/guidance/voluntary-payments-donations-to-...

Re: The time I didn't meet Jeffrey Epstein

#425

Post by throwway120385 »

zozbot234 wrote: post #352
breuleux wrote: post #348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the government doesn't have enough power, the wealthy won't need to bribe politicians to do their bidding. They will do their own bidding directly, and there will be nobody to stop them. It's like, if you want to sell your cyanide penis pills under big government, you need to bribe someone. If you want to sell them under small government, you just... you just sell them, that's what. There may be ways to design a g…

Even a small government still has courts, in fact they would be a far more sizeable fraction of the government and thus a lot more effective. So if people like Epstein engage in criminal behavior, or even just unlawful behavior that they would be liable for, they can definitely be held accountable.

Courts are only a remedy if you're breathing. If the cyanide penis pills kill you and your family then who is left to file suit?

Re: The time I didn't meet Jeffrey Epstein

#426

Post by deadbabe »

tokioyoyo wrote: post #279
KoftaBob wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I think it’s an oversimplification. Epstein isn’t the only “connecting big people to other big people” person. It just happened to be on top of all the shady stuff, he also trafficked kids. I believe there are more people like him, just flying under the radar.

Well, it’s not a crime to connect big people to other big people. If you are not trafficking underage people or smuggling drugs and weapons, chances are no one cares. Doesn’t mean you’re under the radar.

Re: The time I didn't meet Jeffrey Epstein

#427

Post by kiba »

HaZeust wrote: post #407
yboris wrote: post #383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sortition may be what you're looking for: "sortition is the selection of public officials or jurors at random, i.e. by lottery, in order to obtain a representative sample". No one can amass power because it's short term and random. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sortition

I knew about the strategy for using randomness to control corruption, but didn't know it had a procedural name in governance. Thanks for this!

We really only practice it in one instance in modern democracy and that's jury duty, but that should be expanded into more roles and duties. That's one way to make society truly democratic.

In any case, you might be interested in Georgism, which is an anti-monopoly ideology most famously associated with very Strong Opinions on taxation of land and natural resources and untaxing production, along with taxation on pollution and negative externalities.

My impression is that sortition is very much in vogue within Georgist circles.

Re: The time I didn't meet Jeffrey Epstein

#428

Post by throwway120385 »

alphazard wrote: post #399
nicoburns wrote: post #385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Everyone wants taxes to go up on everyone making more than them, and for their own taxes to go down. That's not true at all. I make a good salary as a software engineer, I absolutely think I ought to be taxed a little more than I am, and would gladly pay that money to live in the better society I believe that would create. I believe this attitude is pretty common in many parts of the world. That being said, I do th…

> That's not true at all. I make a good salary as a software engineer, I absolutely think I ought to be taxed a little more than I am, and would gladly pay that money to live in the better society I believe that would create. This confusion is precisely why the middle class has less power than ever before. You and many others have been sold a meme that your tax dollars are in service to a greater good, and you are a…

> At an individual level, for each person in the middle class, 90% of the social programs they pay for are negative EV for them personally. It would be better for each of them if they just kept what they earned, and didn't expect to get it back "later" or "when they really need it" whenever that is. This is an empirical, testable claim, and the math will be slightly different for each person. You should check for yourself.

This whole "expected value" concept when taken to the extreme is just rationalist patter. It's a useful exercise when you're running a business, but there is more to life than fiscal efficiency. Empiricism, when taken to an extreme, is as dystopian as anything else.

90% of those social programs are what keep us from being killed in the street for our watches and jewelry. They keep people less fortunate than us from becoming desperate. They level the playing field so our children aren't all victims of the circumstances of their birth. By those metrics, which are my preferred metrics and not the size of my paycheck, they are a huge benefit.

Also one could argue that the US military is the world's largest social service program in that it provides jobs for a large part of the country that otherwise has no prospects for a good life.

Re: The time I didn't meet Jeffrey Epstein

#429

Post by vee-kay »

ogogmad wrote: post #330
vee-kay wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Lack of informed consent is a serious possible issue here. Lack of accountability might be another one. Being cheaper, by contrast, shouldn't be seen as bad. But all of this needs to be proven.

[flagged]

Re: The time I didn't meet Jeffrey Epstein

#430

Post by vee-kay »

ogogmad wrote: post #316
vee-kay wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Deaths of "many girls", when the parent comment said it was at most 1 out of 2300 participants (a suicide)? Those numbers might, however, be untrustworthy. I don't know India well enough to know how much to trust statistics compiled there. What sources are there on the hospitalisations?

[flagged]
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