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Why aren't smart people happier?

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Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#421
post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

also "Happy People: A Year in the Taiga", film by Werner Herzog

It was shot and directed by a totally different person, a famous Rusdian documentary director. 4 x 1h parts. It is absolutely glorious. After the original movie was made, released and got successful, Werner Herzor made a deal with the director and edited 4 hours of original movie in half, while adding his commentary. He made it A LOT worse, sadly. The only people who rave about it, are the ones who haven't seen the o…

If anyone's interested I think I found it on youtube in english: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLcHbZZPce_ZMUuYr5u6sx...

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#422
Every time I see posts like this I wait for all the 'this is me' narcasistic comments. If you think you are super smart, you should read Schopenhauer. He wrote about how most people vastly overestimate their intelligence and importance, calling vanity and self-delusion universal human flaws. He saw it as part of the reason why humanity fails to learn from history or act rationally—because everyone assumes they are the clever exception. Youare not unhappy because you are so smart.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#423
post #418

Even if you are smart you have to work. And the work isn't necessarily funnier than the "stupid" work that almost anybody can do. I still think I liked my time at construction yard more than my time in front of computer screens. But I do this to be able to pay my bills. There are many counter arguments to the point that smart people are less happy because of what their jobs but I still wanted to say, "better" job is…

Cont. I was always somebody who does well in school and thinks he is smart. But I had some situations that gave me a lesson. E.g. when I was younger I got to know some people who were kind of fun to spend time with but I thought they are a bit crazy, not smart. At some point I noticed, well, they seem to be doing better than I, in fact. They have a nice job, they have friends, they have a comfy apartment, they seem happy. I was a poor technical student in university who was struggling with studies and life, and not finding a great job. So I thought, "I think I'm smart but what use is my smarts if the dumb ones are doing better?" I developed this mindset of forgetting smarts and not categorizing people with that so much. And don't be proud of your smarts, instead show what valuable skills you have.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#424

It’s because everyone else is dumber than them…. So they constantly see avoidable mistakes and misunderstandings that could have been avoided…. Yet they cannot make the other people understand….because they think differently about it, and the people who don’t have that intelligence will not necessarily even be able to reorient their brains for the new information to be absorbed correctly. I constantly get demoralized…

I recently encountered someone who spoke like this and I researched what might be the issue. I came across narcissism. The idea that you’re smarter than everyone else. Comes from a grandiose sense of self importance. But the truth is most people are smarter than you in some ways and less smart in others, but you’re unable to see it because you’re in this black and white mode where preserving your ego relies on you be…

Perhaps there are some people like you say that are grandiose narcissists and ALSO some people that are genuinely smarter than most others in the room and can see the obvious through the fog.

I think the frustration they're experiencing is more likely to do with a lack of control over their environment (including the lack of ability to control others).

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#425

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lot of interesting views in this thread. One thing I loved from Osho (spiritual guru) is the notion that everyone thinks they are "extraordinary" but actually the happiest person is the person who is ordinary. Being ordinary and just eating breakfast and sleeping and doing a job is - in fact - extraordinarily rare.

The same Osho who ran an expensive cult in the 70s and 80s? Putting that aside, it's hard for me to associate simple with happiness. That's the opposite of motivation, from my unenlightened perspective. It's hardly a rational or smart choice since not being challenged also makes one a bit narrower when it comes to seeking out new experiences. But even if you take the intellect out of it, it 'feels' wrong. And some th…

I used to really have a problem understanding why people hold peace as some ideal. It's not that i want violence, it's that if i expand on the idea of peace, I always end at "nothing". Like the idea of heaven, it's pure peace, it's… the lack of all these challenges and struggles and pains on so on. it's nothing! How does that even make sense to strive for a state of nothingness?!

This bothered me for so long until at some point, I just grew up. Peace is not nothing in the sense of null. It's nothing more in the sense of empty. I got this from some buddhist writing: emptiness is not the same as nothingness.

We are vessels and such. I found this tremendously helpful. Peace is like… space for being.

And so simple happiness, I'd say is not rudimentary, it's more like essential? The more I think on it, it's hard not to see the "core" happiness-es as quite profound. Like happy to exist. To experience each sense and such. I'd say that's quite amazing to get to that level of happiness. and we wouldn't call that "complex" happiness?

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#426

I think beyond a certain level surplus IQ begins to cause problems. While still useful, the amount of self-sabotage and thought spirals the brain can generate with the extra power can cause neuroses and unhappiness on a larger scale than those less intelligent are capable of. Combine it with higher societal expectations and it's no great mystery to me why smarter people seem unhappier. Just my thoughts anyways. I'm a…

I agree. I know a guy who is just brilliantly smart but he can get caught up in ruminating or "thought spirals" as you say and is constantly imagining all the ways things can go wrong and is therefore afraid to take any risks or start anything new.

That's the case of my 10yo.

That though of spirals is really a scary thing.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#427

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s really not fixed; you can easily train your mind to be less neurotic and more joyful

> It’s really not fixed; you can easily train your mind to be less neurotic and more joyful How?

The main thing is to start understanding your own neurotic patterns. We constantly move between wanting and avoiding things, from small attachments to our thoughts and habits, to strong dislikes. The more you understand this pattern, the more you can let go, and the less your daily feelings will disturb you. As that happens, a natural joy will start to appear. The truth is, 90% of what triggers your emotions today will be gone in hour, 98% within a day, and 99.9% won’t matter at all when you die.

The biggest step is realizing this pattern. Training it comes through awareness. Then, stepping outside yourself helps a lot. Doing things for others, like helping with food serving or similar directly useful things, takes you out of that self-focused mode where everything is about what you want or need. It feels like a hack, but doing things for others is natural for humans.

Something that's common in the west: an empty feeling, feels for people like the truth. But it's often a self oriented way of thinking with a subtle form of aversion. This is why often things like sports, friends or helping, can take people out of this way of thinking instantly.

Meditation can also help. I’d focus on less rational forms, with compassion and visualization, since they make it easier to connect with a sense of meaning. The issue here with the Western approach is that it's all goal oriented: less stress & more success. This goal oriented approach reinforces self-obsessed thinking; which is why lots of spiritual paths tend to focus on doing it for others to avoid this trap. In the beginning this is a bit of a trick; at some point it will be natural.

And lastly, understanding that life moves in waves, with ups and downs that always come and go, helps you stay less attached to your own thoughts & feelings in your reaction to life's events; and then life events will have less impact on your mood.

A few mindful experiences with psychedelics, used with the intention to see life’s patterns, can also offer insight. They can help you find meaning instead of falling into nihilism when you realise everything is impermanent (which most people already have).

The difference with such an approach vs western conventional therapy is that it's not focused on the content of your thoughts & feelings but starting to let go of the seriousness of them in general. They are not mutually exclusive.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#428

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Note: I wrote this comment after reading just the title... Not sure if the irony is intended, but I find it hilarious.

If you want me to read your article it has to be at most 1024 characters and served as text/plain

With a bullet-point summary. /s

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#429

  Wise in measure let each man be;
  but let him not wax too wise;
  for never the happiest of men is he
  who knows much of many things.

  Wise in measure should each man be;
  but let him not wax too wise;
  seldom a heart will sing with joy
  if the owner be all too wise.

  Wise in measure should each man be,
  but ne'er let him wax too wise:
  who looks not forward to learn his fate
  unburdened heart will bear.
That's Hávamál, from ~thousand years ago, give or take.

Re: Why aren't smart people happier?

#430

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd take a different answer to this question: philosophy. In times before Abrahamic religion developing or adopting a life philosophy was seen as a practical obligation for a man. This is where you saw the rise of everything from the Pythagorean to the Stoics. It seems that the rise of Abrahamic religions is what largely brought an end to this and mandated a sort of one-size-fits-all philosophy for everybody. Now in…

The miniscule amount of written work that survives to the present really makes it difficult to do any more than speculate about the philosophies broadly held in the times before Abrahamic religion.

Abrahamic religion didn't really became a major factor in the world until Constantine. So for instance for the entirety of Ancient Greece and the majority of Ancient Rome, Abrahamic religions had no meaningful influence, and there are extensive writings from this time. But while I think it's useful to consider their views, I again think the real goal is to develop one's own philosophy.

We all have different perspectives on life. For instance many things that people all value like freedom and security, are mutually exclusive at extremes. In ancient times one could also see a wide array of philosophies that all sought a similar end of 'happiness' or contentedness, yet they took radically different perspectives on the way to achieve such - e.g. stoicism vs epicureanism.

But these are issues that many people simply never stop to even consider what they think about, and so they drift somewhat aimlessly which I think is going to make it very difficult to find contentedness and direction in life.

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