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Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

thehill.com

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Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#421

Post by like_any_other »

legitster wrote: post #172

So I was at a company that did this a lot - it was much less nefarious than on the surface. It was usually related to them recruiting a certain specialist or acquiring a team at another company. But the only way to get these people visas was to post the jobs publicly and hide them as much as possible. They did this by the hundreds, and it wasn't really a cost saving measure - if you are trying to get anybody in parti…

> Is it unfair? Maybe. But in my opinion anything is fairer than our country's evil immigration requirements.

For some reason those stupid racist citizens don't want to compete with the whole world in a borderless economic zone. Thankfully we have wise corporations to subvert democracy for the better.

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#422

Post by AdrianB1 »

wizzwizz4 wrote: post #419
zjaffee wrote: post #412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except this isn't about H1B this is about the PERM process for EB2/EB3 greencards. The truth is we should be much more open to temporary work permits, and much less open to this sort of thing for granting permanent residency. Tons of people getting employment based green cards hold jobs that could easily be filled by an American.

"You can only stay in the country if you're sponsored by an employer" creates an environment where workers have low bargaining power, decreasing the pressure for good working conditions (e.g. high pay), which – among other things – has impacts on the working conditions for locals. One might say it "affects what the market will sustain" (personally, I don't think calling everything a "market" is insightful). From a pu…

From an economic perspective the ideal is no borders if there are no significant differences between countries that would create an infinite surge in mobility. It's like electrical current, if there is zero resistance and a difference in potential, any short circuit will potentially destroy the entire circuit.

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#423

Post by y-curious »

buckle8017 wrote: post #148
back2dafucha wrote: post #112

Old news. This has been going on for decades. If you even look badly on youtube you will find corporate videos from "HR Consultants" teaching companies how to bury job listings so noone will be likely to find them. Your country sold you down the river 30 years ago.

The thing this article didn't mention and the author likely doesn't know is that there's a guide going around instructing people on how to apply for H1B jobs on forums like 4chan.

So what if it comes from 4chan? I think it's a good thing for citizens to try and get jobs that should be going to them, no matter the source

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#424

Post by y-curious »

teeray wrote: post #349
cjbgkagh wrote: post #180

Instead of having job openings posted by those who don't want them found what if people posted willingness to work, perhaps in some sort of registry. That way a company would have to prove that none of the people willing to work are qualified. I'm sure many qualified people would be open to moving.

At the very least, if you want an H1-B, companies should be forced to post the secret jobs on a standardized, embarrassingly public database. Think MLS, but for jobs.

The fact that Instacart threatened legal action against jobs.now is proof that you're correct

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#425

Post by AdrianB1 »

thephyber wrote: post #310
malfist wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does the US have such a shortage of artistic talent we have to hire abroad for it?

Why get hung out on the example profession and not the fact that some jobs pay drastically disproportionate rates? Linus developed Linux, but we wouldn’t be able to hire the next version of him because hedge funds would dominate the high salary reqs in this hypothetical system.

If you cannot pay for it, it means it is not important enough. Maybe that is the problem, you want exceptional talent for pennies.

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#426

Post by bubblethink »

colmmacc wrote: post #409
groggler wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But these professions tend to earn a fraction of what a software developer makes. Then the market says it doesn't need them. Fix market mechanics so hiring another tech worker isn't worth multiples of things people say society should value. I.e. maybe there is too much upside in software sales since copies are free to the IP owner, liability is limited, lock-in is often impractical to escape, etc.

Completely open borders migration between all countries would be the biggest such market correction. If every development job was open to every qualified developer in the world, I suspect software salaries in the US would be much lower.

But they would still be higher than a chemist's salary. This has nothing to do with open borders. If you use money as a proxy, some professions will come out ahead. That's just market dynamics. The only way to avoid that is to create carve outs or normalization by profession.

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#428

Post by bubblethink »

cbarrick wrote: post #417
epolanski wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Your country sold you down the river 30 years ago. Jm2c but I think the harsh truth is that US while having a decently sized population of good software engineers, it is still nowhere near the required amount. Thus, many companies would rather give 150/200k to someone who's actually good at it and will be impressed by that money rather than some half assed US graduate who only went into SE because he wanted a cushy…

> it is still nowhere near the required amount. How do you reconcile that with all of the SWE layoffs in the past few years?

Companies are always going to lay people off, because they can and it is in their financial interest to do so when the shareholders or investors demand cutbacks. AFAIK, Amazon even has a formalized stack ranking system where a certain percentage will be laid off every year to make room for new talent. This has nothing to do with visas or immigrants. If you want to stop that, you need better worker protections, but that's a separate discussion.

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#429

Post by AdrianB1 »

kccqzy wrote: post #206
1024core wrote: post #202

A lot of these problems could be solved if H1-B's were given out in order of salary (I think there's such a proposal going around recently). And by that I mean: something like a Dutch auction. Give H1-Bs to the top 85K paying jobs (maybe normalized to SoL in the region, I'm sure the BLS has some idea on how to do it). The lure of H1-Bs is the money savings, and the fact that if you're on an H1-B, you're practically a…

The lure of H-1B is not really the money savings. Go look at the graduating class of computer science students at large universities. A large fraction are international students. Universities thrive on them since they pay the most tuition and are generally not allowed any financial aid. Companies want to hire them in addition to U.S. citizens. That's it. No Silicon Valley company that I know of pays H-1B and citizens…

I work (in Europe) for an American company. All the people in IT we hire in USA are foreigners, they are cheaper. You cannot say it is discrimination on wages because everyone is paid low. The visa system allows the company to pay low wages and hiring foreigners is just a small detail in the scheme.

Anecdotal statistic, in my department all the people in US and Canada hired in the past 10-15 years are from Africa or India. The only Americans or Canadians are the managers, they joined 20-30 years ago and slowly retiring, now being replaced mostly by Indians.

It is happening the same in Western Europe, just with a different demographic.

Re: Corporations are trying to hide job openings from US citizens

#430

Post by AdrianB1 »

abenga wrote: post #354
DaSHacka wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The US needs immigrants. At the expense of the citizenry?

It is not a zero sum game (long term). Immigrants and their children have founded companies that have employed thousands of American citizens and created trillions of dollars of wealth. Stopping what has worked for your country because "…reasons…" is extremely shortsighted.

It is an exception used to justify the rule. There is a very small percentage that founded companies and the rest are impacting negatively the economy.
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