Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome • Hacker News Board

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#421

Post by erifneerg » Fri, Jul 25, 2025, 5:24 PM UTC

SJC_Hacker wrote: post #57

It was well on its way to being eliminated in much of the First World through screening during pregnancy at around 2-3 months. Alot of mothers were electing to terminate the pregnancy and perhaps try again. Especially much of Europe which didn't quite have the moral objections against abortion that the US does, save for a few countries who still have substantial observant Catholics such as Ireland and Poland. Here's…

According to a NYT article from 2022, there's a high false positive.

Title: When They Warn of Rare Disorders, These Prenatal Tests Are Usually Wrong Authors: Sarah Kliff & Aatish Bhatia

https://web.archive.org/web/20250712195745/https://www.nytim...

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#422

Post by somenameforme » Fri, Jul 25, 2025, 5:28 PM UTC

chongli wrote: post #406

somenameforme wrote: post #350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not a huge fan of Axios, but chose to link to them for two reasons. (1) They leave their stories bullet pointed instead of feeding them into an LLM, or a human LLM, to add 5,000 words of fluff, and (2) they use extensive citations. Here [1], for instance, is a recent Pew study they linked to. All the studies have Christianity as the driver. And FWIW church itself is not a neutral term. Church => Christian, Mosque…

I do appreciate their citations but the spin is a bit much. I’m still very skeptical about the interpretation of a “return to religiosity” rather than religious immigrants continuing their religious observances in their new home countries. To show a proper “return to religious observance” (any religion, not just Christianity) means showing a large number of people who attend religious services regularly but whose par…

I agree that immigration is probably playing a role, perhaps even a significant one, in these numbers, but at the same time this is also expected even without immigration. Religious families are having more children which means that, over time, there would be an inflection such that a generation starts becoming significantly more religious than the one prior - even if it's 100% because the children of that generation were born to religious families. Bringing over large numbers of religious immigrants is just speed running this endgame.

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#423

Post by toomuchtodo » Fri, Jul 25, 2025, 5:28 PM UTC

lurk2 wrote: post #416

toomuchtodo wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do feel the same way of my existence being discussed this way. Would anything be different had I not existed? No, besides my brief life experience and interactions I’ve had with other humans not occurring. I wouldn’t have even known I never existed. Is that good or bad? Right or wrong? No, it just is.

> Would anything be different had I not existed? No, besides my brief life experience and interactions I’ve had with other humans not occurring. “Besides” is doing a lot of work here.

We perhaps disagree about the value of the human experience based on lived experiences.

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#424

Post by margalabargala » Fri, Jul 25, 2025, 5:38 PM UTC

lurk2 wrote: post #407

margalabargala wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That video is about abortion. Before birth. So no, they're not trying.

In the video they are discussing the prospect of aborting the pregnancy as the child is being born.

This is a great example because it strengthens the original one I was making; that despite pearl-clutching about what something "could allow", the actual bad thing that they're concerned about never happens. It's just a distraction tactic.

Plenty of states, like Alaska and Oregon, already allow abortion right up to the moment of birth. They don't happen, ever, zero times, except in cases where somebody is going to die otherwise.

The handwringing over "omg they're killing children" actually just kills both children and mothers by making lifesaving procedures illegal. People don't carry unwanted babies to term unless forced to do so.

Thus making it illegal to abort a full-term baby does nothing but score political points, at the expense of the deaths of some mothers who desperately wanted a child and then had some complications.

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#425

Post by WOTERMEON » Fri, Jul 25, 2025, 5:45 PM UTC

smeej wrote: post #397

frotaur wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but that is not a good arguments. Example of unique living organisms include bacteria, tardigrades, or paramecia.

Yes, but none of those are of the human species. A Hunan zygote is a unique living human organism, and I think history has shown us we must at least be very, very careful when we start arguing that some unique living human organisms are different enough from the unique living human organisms that matter that it should be morally acceptable to kill them. Maybe this really is different from all the things about which w…

“Never again” has been said in a completely different context: fully developed humans killing other developed humans systematically on a huge scale across years. Don’t confuse ethnic cleanings and genocide with fully voluntary abortions, as sad as they may be.

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#426

Post by damion6 » Fri, Jul 25, 2025, 5:47 PM UTC

puppycodes wrote: post #10

Interesting, I wonder what else this might lead too! Encouraging we might be getting somewhere. I used to live near a Down syndrome center where a bunch of folks lived and I remember this one lady who was kitted out with Britney Spears everything, lunchbox, t-shirt, hat, and headphones. Everyday I passed by the bus stop she would be dancing her heart out to a Britney track waiting for the bus and it made my world a l…

[dead]

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#427

Post by BriggyDwiggs42 » Fri, Jul 25, 2025, 5:56 PM UTC

smeej wrote: post #397

frotaur wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but that is not a good arguments. Example of unique living organisms include bacteria, tardigrades, or paramecia.

Yes, but none of those are of the human species. A Hunan zygote is a unique living human organism, and I think history has shown us we must at least be very, very careful when we start arguing that some unique living human organisms are different enough from the unique living human organisms that matter that it should be morally acceptable to kill them. Maybe this really is different from all the things about which w…

> unique living human organisms are different enough from the unique living human organisms that matter that it should be morally acceptable to kill them

I think what we should care about isn’t human life, but human consciousness. A person in a vegetative state doesn’t suffer when you pull the plug. The difference matters and is unmistakable between large organisms which have gone through a long process of development and tiny ones which have not; we should reasonably presume that only one of the two is conscious given no further evidence.

The likely response is the potential argument, and I don’t care about that. I care about human suffering.

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#428

Post by calf » Fri, Jul 25, 2025, 6:07 PM UTC

shlant wrote: post #362

djeastm wrote: post #339

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is "birth defect" a eugenically-charged word? I've never heard it used in such a manner, just as a matter of fact.

don't seriously engage with people who would rather morally grandstand and tone police than have important conversations

Stating something is sophistry is not tone policing. Pointless to explain this to those who lack critical thinking skills in the first place. Rather, it is you who are doing the policing from a self-assured conservativism so common to the HN crowd, it is time someone pointed this out. There's no good faith engagement under such a context.

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#429

Post by calf » Fri, Jul 25, 2025, 6:10 PM UTC

derektank wrote: post #402

calf wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Using a loaded term such as "defect" is exactly eugenics sophistry.

If you want to call it an error, or simply a change, I'm happy to make the argument on those terms. Changes in the development process that leave a child disabled for life, but which can be prevented, such as FAS through alcohol abstinence, spina bifida through folic acid intake, and (if this research can be translated into a treatment) Down Syndrome through the targeted removal of the superfluous chromosome, should…

None of your arguments fly. Try to think like an programmer--kick the corner case of the arguments. I'm not suggesting anything other than pointing out that most arguments on here have been well trodden by ethicists and even they have no consensus. My personal belief about the specific issue is not even relevant. My objection is the low quality of argument (by several commenters) demonstrating a kind of prejudiced take, I find that the most offensive.

Here you moved from defect to disabled. I don't have to personally say that a group are/aren't disabled, to yet again point out your argument rests on an assumed definition otherwise yet another form of word loading. This is a really basic critical thinking skills example independent of the topic.

Re: Scientists may have found a way to eliminate chromosome linked to Down syndrome

#430

Post by exe34 » Fri, Jul 25, 2025, 6:11 PM UTC

topato wrote: post #419

exe34 wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> but we can't blame people for what they are/are not attracted to That's an odd thing to bring up randomly.

I think it's because you said "cunts" lol

Ah the "straight" was the adjective to qualify the noun, not the other way round! I.e. the same cunts who will get disgusted by two men kissing and try to harm them, will get turned on by seeing two women kissing and therefore it appears that the latter are more accepted. It's not kindness or open-mindedness, it's pure sleaze.