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Deepseek: The quiet giant leading China’s AI race

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421–430 of 476 posts

Re: Deepseek: The quiet giant leading China’s AI race

#421
post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> China creates a superbug via GOF research In 2024, this isn't fact, it's just baseless conspiracy. All evidence has ended up pointing to bush meat contamination.

In 2024, zoonotic origin is considered more probable, but it is by no means a "baseless conspiracy" to believe otherwise.

More derailing than baseless, whether or not Xi did it on purpose or if the CIA did it or if aliens did it has no relevance to how they handed the event after it happened.

Re: Deepseek: The quiet giant leading China’s AI race

#422
post #332

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How would we know if a Chinese company's books on training costs and expenditures was accurate?

are you on CCP's payroll for covering their rise in AI? you are basically implying that people shouldn't believe the progress they made and thus don't need to take it seriously. nice job, you should get a pretty solid performance review result.

Oh I take China seriously, I'm merely reminding people to not blindly accept stated figures from the CCP.

Re: Deepseek: The quiet giant leading China’s AI race

#423

So much spam around this model. LocalLLaMA is stuffed with spam posts and even hacker news is getting spammed. Who has actually ran this model and verified performance? Does anyone know of a decent review from a trustworthy source?

Where’s the spam? I scrolled dozens of posts without seeing a single mention of this—the biggest (certainly the most interesting) LLM news recently. When something big happens with Claude or ChatGPT there are more posts, but nobody calls that “spam”. Anyways, if you were actually following locallama (a subreddit about running LLMs locally, where this is by far the biggest and most relevant news topic currently) you’d…

I am not GPU poor and don't care about speed. I care about how good the model is which is much harder to measure and much harder to do. I have not seen many independent reviews. There are finally some coming out now but a lot of this is just marketing hype to drive attention. Every AI company does it.

Re: Deepseek: The quiet giant leading China’s AI race

#424

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Chinese government treated the pandemic as a bioweapon attack by a foreign adversary engaged in a broader hybrid war, and it did so effectively.

That's batshit insane.

A country targeted in an ongoing hybrid war by the world's #1 superpower would have a (relatively) extreme response to a pandemic that originated in an epidemiologically interesting location deep in their inland territory, and that extreme response having any substantial national security impetuous is "batshit insane". Insightful contribution!

A big country would never overreact to national security threats. We have the TSA to protect us from that :)

Re: Deepseek: The quiet giant leading China’s AI race

#425

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. That's the best example - completely inundated with government propaganda, and yet millions of people are freely consuming it daily and shaping their world view around it. When you look at Reddit CEO's board affiliations, it starts to become clear this is not accidental.

It's funny how a poster talking about Westerners are completely inundated with propaganda has made previous comments such as: "The Chinese government treated the pandemic as a bioweapon attack by a foreign adversary engaged in a broader hybrid war, and it did so effectively"

What is inaccurate about that comment?

Re: Deepseek: The quiet giant leading China’s AI race

#426

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where’s the spam? I scrolled dozens of posts without seeing a single mention of this—the biggest (certainly the most interesting) LLM news recently. When something big happens with Claude or ChatGPT there are more posts, but nobody calls that “spam”. Anyways, if you were actually following locallama (a subreddit about running LLMs locally, where this is by far the biggest and most relevant news topic currently) you’d…

I am not GPU poor and don't care about speed. I care about how good the model is which is much harder to measure and much harder to do. I have not seen many independent reviews. There are finally some coming out now but a lot of this is just marketing hype to drive attention. Every AI company does it.

Just because you’re out of touch with the community, and your wishes don’t align with the rest of us, doesn’t mean a major event is “spam”.

Re: Deepseek: The quiet giant leading China’s AI race

#427
post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whoever are downvoting this really don't understand that expanding a congested highway merely widens the congestion instead of alleviating it. Software today require several dozen gigabytes of RAM and two dozen CPU cores just to render some simple fucking text because everyone has several dozen gigabytes of RAM and two dozen CPU cores.

This is one of the biggest reasons why China or India are threat to the West. Because their Engineers are constantly in situations were they have to work with much less resources. And they come up with stuff that constantly surprises people for being much cheaper. The western reaction is to then go and buy them out. Its not going to work forever. They have already taken over large swathes of the tech landscape. Even…

In the Chinese model they disappear their leading entrepreneurs, which is problematic.

Re: Deepseek: The quiet giant leading China’s AI race

#428

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. The Chinese internal market is huge, and in case they develop models that are better than western models, not using them will be a disadvantage for us, not them. Also I can see many European countries (including my country, Italy) to buy Chinese AI regardless of US regulations. 2. Western has its own issues with data limits and extreme alignment that makes models dumber. In general I don't think the Chinese govern…

1.) EU will soon have rules to prevent Chinese AI from proliferating, since China is ramping up on its support of Russia invasion of Europe - China Is Cutting Off Drone Supplies Critical to Ukraine War Effort [1]. China is reportedly making drones for Russia instead, according to multiple intelligence officials. 2.) Chinese models have to censor a long list of words that threatens the government, which makes them sup…

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Re: Deepseek: The quiet giant leading China’s AI race

#429

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's batshit insane.

A country targeted in an ongoing hybrid war by the world's #1 superpower would have a (relatively) extreme response to a pandemic that originated in an epidemiologically interesting location deep in their inland territory, and that extreme response having any substantial national security impetuous is "batshit insane". Insightful contribution! A big country would never overreact to national security threats. We have…

I was referring to your characterization of the situation.

Re: Deepseek: The quiet giant leading China’s AI race

#430

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This comment is misleading. There is a "free lunch" here in the sense that serving this model is far cheaper than worse, open source models at scale. Yes they probably are more willing to go down in price due to this, but the architecture is open, and they are charging similarly to a 30B-50B dense model, which is about how many active params deepseek-v3 has.

So then OP is correct? Your comment confirms the same sentiment about the tradeoff API users make: cheaper inference means you pay with your data. Sure Deepseek may publish their weights so you dont have to use the API, but the point still stands for the API.

Its a matter of degree. If 90% of the cost savings are from a new, smarter architecture, it doesn't make sense to point to the API terms as the reason for it being so cheap.
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