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Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

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Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#421

Post by kqr »

dns_snek wrote: post #368
kqr wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get that this type of situation is emotionally difficult, but advice for anyone willing to take it: if the point is getting information, a confrontational "you can't do this to me" type tone is probably less helpful than a curious "you owe me nothing but if you want to brighten my day a little here's what I'm curious about" attitude.

I don't think anyone being fired for bullshit reasons is going to be in the mood to try to butter up some corporate drones delivering the news.

Definitely not! Faking that mood is one of the most difficult skills of being a good negotiator.

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#422

Post by ProllyInfamous »

block_dagger wrote: post #10

A similar situation happened to me after 7.5 years at a company where I had been given consistently good feedback and promotions. I was fed the lie that my position was being eliminated when there were active public postings for the same position (Staff Engineer). My access to corporate systems was cut off at 8am with no warning or explanatio. I got a similar cold call from an HR person I had met once by chance. No i…

Over a decade ago, a data center hired me as "an apprentice electrician." The economy wasn't doing well, so layoffs lead to me "covering" displaced workers' non-electrician tasks (NEVER VOLUNTEER to assume such work). When the full-time janitor was fired [1], you could find me tidily sweeping and restocking toilet paper...

Eventually I was promoted to a more-technical role, but was required to "train my replacement before leaving the department" [this took MONTHs!]. Meanwhile, the facilities manager decided to schedule me for all the confined spaces work, without OSHA-approved monitors ["due to staffing shortcuts"].

Under loud & written protest, I refused such dangerous placements [2]. This ultimately led not to my promotion/transfer, but being constructively terminated. The suddenness and disrespect was as obvious as when they "fired" the janitor [1]... one second I'm filling out TPS Reports, the next second I'm seeing that my access has been restricted.

[1] They just disabled his entrybadge, without even telling him beforehand (he showed up "to work" and wasn't allowed on-site!).

[2] During the OSHA investigation, company claimed "he volunteers to do everything, often without approval".

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#423

Post by [deleted] »

IvyMike wrote: post #25

I get why Brittany's mad: Cloudflare appears to be handling this about as bad as possible. But those two HR randos aren't gonna have anything worthwhile to say, either. I don't want to be judgmental of Brittany because it's a sucky call to have to take. But my recommendation in this situation is to say "I disagree with that assessment of my performance, but I understand you are terminating my employment. What details…

[deleted]

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#424

Post by noeatnosleep »

boh_grey wrote: post #199
NicoJuicy wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In my books she did well, You don't have the details and she had 0 sales. You're basing yourself on a TikTok video, with someone who knew it was being recorded and acted accordingly. Eg. Cloudflare 's products are very technical and perhaps she has too little general IT knowledge to be able to close a deal ( she mentioned to have 3 chances and closed 0 )

As someone very close to an ex-CF employee, I can state with authority that the company does very little to help it's employees come up to speed. Their training process is essentially a bunch of CF employees doing unimpressive powerpoint presentations. Their internal documentation is a huge Wiki and it's not really very well maintained. Their internal config management system is absolute trash and I'm convinced that…

That's above and beyond what most companies do to get you up to speed.

I feel like you meant for this to be a bad thing, but you're literally telling us that CF is better than a lot of other places.

Lots of places just have a google drive folder (or whatever, at scale) and you're expected to show up to meetings and pretend you're not confused.

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#425

Post by cstrahan »

sanderjd wrote: post #376
cstrahan wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's a bummer, but this is how this has been done for decades (generations?) and everybody knows it's how it's done, and that has in no way made companies "think twice" about business leaders assigning fairly low level employees or consultants to do these meetings just like this. No, avoiding the words "we're laying you off" by lying about your performance and telling you that you're instead being fired is not "how…

You don't think employers have pretty much always tried to avoid being required to pay severance and unemployment? If so, that seems to me like an unrealistically rosy view of the past.

I’m well aware that bad behavior is a thing. Some driver’s cut each other off in traffic, weaving in and out of lanes. Some customers condescend to service workers, knowing they can’t retaliate without losing their jobs. And some reprobate employers do shitty things like we’re seeing here.

Are you really arguing against me when I say that this is exceptionally abhorrent?

That’s all I’m saying: that this isn’t the kind of thing to shrug at. There are plenty of companies lead by grade A people that treat their employees well instead of heartlessly throwing them under the bus.

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#426

Post by NicoJuicy »

op00to wrote: post #408
boh_grey wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't get to be a (retired) 100x engineer by posting on HN. I don't post stories regularly but did in this case because a friend sent me the link. I did post it to warn others about CF. > Since you posted the link and I see very little history here, I can't acknowledge your claim of authority yet and I can only suspect, without certainty, personal grievances or conflicts of interests. Suspect away. When someone yo…

Oh yeah? I'm a 1000000000x engineer, formed entirely through posting on HN, and I think you're full of beans.

You're spilling the beans on that guy

That's not nice

;)

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#427

Post by westpfelia »

epolanski wrote: post #398
aaomidi wrote: post #372

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have more reason to believe this person than I do cloudflare.

Practice being skeptical.

Right? I mean who is more likely to be shady and do crooked things? Some person or a business? Can anyone even name a single time when a company has fired someone without real cause and lied?

/S

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#428

Post by cstrahan »

IvyMike wrote: post #346
cstrahan wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What is the biggest potential upside? The upside is an emotional one: not feeling saddened from letting someone easily walk all over you. In the case of this woman's termination, they have lied to her face about her performance, and would presumably also lie to anyone that asked about the cause of her termination (they would say she was fired, when it was a lay off). They probably expected her to just silently take…

> If it was intentional, I would tell them that I am sorry for their condition: that they feel that the only way to be seen is to bug people in indirect ways (as they are clearly too chickenshit to resort to outright violence) because they are too worthless a person to pay any mind to otherwise. Me being Don Draper in the elevator.

I’m not entirely sure if I follow, but my guess is that the comparison to a fictional character known for being aggressive is intended to (maybe playfully?) tease me.

I don’t see it as exceptionally aggressive to call people out on their bullshit. If you have the ability to humble someone being an asshat, they just may learn it’s in their best interest to chill out, which could possibly spare someone else - maybe someone else that doesn’t have the strength to stand up for themselves.

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#429

Post by westpfelia »

yreg wrote: post #349
cheeselip420 wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Legally, yes. But she could experience some consequences if future employers don't feel great about this.

What about NDAs? What hashtag should I follow to watch more US corp internal meetings?

How did she break an NDA with this video?

You are right you cant just record and out out there just ANY corporate material. But you getting fired? This aint it.

Re: Cloudflare employee posts layoff call with HR and goes viral [video]

#430

Post by westpfelia »

op00to wrote: post #406
gumballindie wrote: post #357

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Software developers are used to being docile, but in oder industries being brave is a virtue. She’d make an excellent lawyer or leader. I dont understand why fellow workers are so angry at her if not the fear and terror at being in her shoes. Anxiety is common among keyboard operators. Watching this video is a great tutorial on how to change that.

Nothing she did helped her find a new job, nor did it help her keep her old job. I think the term is "pissing into the wind".

I mean youre wrong. Anyone worth their salt is going to see that she clearly laid out what she was doing right, how fast in a 3 month time period she was ramping up to the product and had already made inroads with her customers. You want sales people who are that assertive.
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