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Is my plane a 737 MAX?

ismyplanea737max.com

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Re: Is my plane a 737 MAX?

#421

Post by kmeisthax »

jessriedel wrote: post #299
dralley wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True, but as integrator, Boeing is still responsible for ensuring the quality of the final product.

You can also argue that the airline is responsible for operating only quality products

The US justice system has a notion of "joint and several liability", where we say "both parties are guilty and both are liable for the damages". I think that applies here:

- It's the assembler's responsibility to make sure the exit door bolts are properly tightened, and

- It's the manufacturer's responsibility to find assemblers that correctly tighten door bolts, and the manufacturer's responsibility to design doors that don't explode, and

- It's the airline's responsibility to find manufacturers that design planes with not exploding doors, which are assembled by assemblers that correctly tighten door bolts, and checked by the airline's own maintenance teams during regular servicing of the planes.

Everyone should be looking over and double-checking everyone else's work. But that's not how the 737 MAX was designed or built.

Re: Is my plane a 737 MAX?

#422

Post by Consultant32452 »

spacemark wrote: post #374
miketery wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I spoke to someone who works there about a year ago. I was trying to gauge how an insider viewed the Max problem related to the auto trim issue which caused two airplanes [1][2] to crash, killing 346 people. This was shortly after watching the documentary Downfall: The Case Against Boeing [3]. The ignorance and non acceptance of fault made me cringe. I won't go into the details, but this wasn't a freak accident this…

All valid points, but I wonder if you've overshot your response to this (very slight) increase of risk to your personal safety. The statistical safety of aviation is the best it has ever been - 2023 set yet another record low for commercial aviation deaths and injuries. Your automobile trip to the grocery store is far riskier.

>Your automobile trip to the grocery store is far riskier.

I feel it's important to provide complete information. Flying is safer per mile traveled than driving. Driving is safer on a per-trip basis.

So if you compare your trip to the grocery store to your flight to visit extended family, the trip to your grocery store is safer. But if you compare 10,000 miles of driving back and forth to the grocery store over many trips vs a single 10,000 mile flight, the flight is safer.

Re: Is my plane a 737 MAX?

#423

Post by caskstrength »

dionidium wrote: post #311
legitster wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The trend is heading the wrong way. Contrary to this sentiment, air traffic safety continues to improve: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aviation_accidents_and_inciden... If anything, air travel is so safe now that non-fatal incidents such as this weeks' stand out more than they would have in previous decades. And in comparison, driving is getting much more dangerous (at least in the US). https://en.wikipedia.org/wik…

You'll sometimes see this dismissed almost derisively as, "people think they're in control when they're driving, but lack agency while flying, so that's why they fear the latter more." But that's completely true! Not every driver on the road is at equal risk of a fatal accident. A significant percentage of all fatal accident involve speeding, reckless driving, and/or alcohol consumption, to say nothing of distraction…

You don't have control over drunk-driver-in-heavy-pickup-truck-who-is-browsing-instagram-while-speeding crushing into you on the road.

Re: Is my plane a 737 MAX?

#424

Post by jedmeyers »

dheera wrote: post #396
jerf wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It may be illogical from a strictly individual point of view. But from a broader societal view we'd all be better off if we did it and it is pro-social and pro-civic to be willing to sacrifice a little of your personal convenience to make a point like this. Nothing but nothing will get Boeing's attention like what is essentially an end-customer strike. In general quite a lot of the chains wrapped around us that drive…

> willing to sacrifice a little of your personal convenience It's not convenience, it's that the ONLY reasonably priced flights are non-refundable ones, and not everyone can afford another flight ticket just to prove a point. Another idiotic thing that we need to change. Although I really do wish there were an "Airbus only" option when booking flight tickets. And as much as I don't normally like to stereotype things,…

Alaska temporary switched to the flexible travel policy because of this incident, so you should be able to change your ticket fairly easily.

Re: Is my plane a 737 MAX?

#425

Post by ssijak »

the_mitsuhiko wrote: post #313
davely wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In 2010, an Airbus A380 engine exploded. The fact that it landed safely was a miracle. [1] In 2017, an Airbus A380 lost an engine (literally, fell off the plane). [2] In 2018, a cockpit windshield blew out in an Airbus A319. [3] Don't get me wrong, the culture at Boeing has changed (for the worse). The 737 Max is not without issues. It's horrific that hundreds have died due to both ignorance and deception on behalf o…

I find the A380 accidents quite fascinating. If there is a plane I want to lose an engine on it’s one with four on it for sure. :)

A380 can loose only one engine and fly, same as smaller planes, they can loose an engine and land.

Re: Is my plane a 737 MAX?

#427

Post by pirate787 »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #301

If you are outraged and want to be more than performative about it, check if your electeds are on the Senate Aviation Safety, Operations, and Innovation [1] and/or House Aviation Subcommittees [2]. If not, the broader Senate Commerce, Science and Transportation [3] and/or House Transportation & Infrastructure Committees [4]. Call their office (D.C., preferably) or submit a comment noting the issue and your concerns a…

Also I'd contact your favorite airlines and demand that they retire their MAX planes.

https://www.transportation.gov/airconsumer/airline-consumer-...

Re: Is my plane a 737 MAX?

#428

Post by Aloha »

Fischgericht wrote: post #410

I find it puzzling that airlines are still ordering this plane. It's not just us, the customers, who should "vote with their feet", but the airlines, too. I would not buy from a vendor that is not able to have a QA process that makes sure all screws and bolts are in place, fastened and secured. Even if it would not be an airplane where this is critical for safety, even if it would just be a toaster, I would stop buyi…

Buying something else means a pilot/fleet mismatch, and higher retraining costs

Re: Is my plane a 737 MAX?

#429

Post by is_true »

WalterBright wrote: post #310
jerf wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It may be illogical from a strictly individual point of view. But from a broader societal view we'd all be better off if we did it and it is pro-social and pro-civic to be willing to sacrifice a little of your personal convenience to make a point like this. Nothing but nothing will get Boeing's attention like what is essentially an end-customer strike. In general quite a lot of the chains wrapped around us that drive…

Boeing stock is down substantially. That will get their attention.

10% doesn't seem much. I was expecting it to be worse

Re: Is my plane a 737 MAX?

#430

Post by netsharc »

jjav wrote: post #362
gruez wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>those use actual flight plan data, so will take into account any last minute aircraft changes. But at that point it's too late. I doubt people are that afraid of 737 Max that they'll cancel a flight (and forfeit their ticket) over it.

The planes only start transmitting when they are ready to go (not sure if they do it after pulling out of the gate or when doors close or thereabouts). So by the time you see the flight data you're most likely boarded already. So yes, too late.

I don't think this is true, in any case you can extrapolate, e.g. if you're leaving from gate 34, see which flight of this airline is arriving at gate 34 just before, then you can check that flight's details, including plane model, on the tracking websites
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