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80% of bosses say they regret earlier return-to-office plans

cnbc.com

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Re: 80% of bosses say they regret earlier return-to-office plans

#421

Post by PM_me_your_math »

catmanjan wrote: post #338
dougmwne wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I think you’ve really got it there. The federal government is absolutely trying to orchestrate this situation for the benefit of companies. They try to keep unemployment at a sweet spot number where not too many people are living on the street, but companies have a pliable and plentiful labor pool. It’s achieved through a careful balance of monetary policy, taxes, immigration, education, and laws limiting reprod…

Is it really possible for an individual to “build wealth” without exploiting the working class

Exploited? Working for a living is called being an adult. The inverse of which is sticking your hand out and demanding that everyone carry you through adult life. People who agree to work for someone else are, in no way, being exploited. You have a choice to be a bum, as much as you have a choice where to work. And your options are greater when you're not a bum and have marketable skills that employers are willing pay for. Furthermore, if you're not a bum and you acquire skills, you can start your own business and do extremely well for yourself, and support dozens, if not hundreds or thousands of families if your business requires employees. I'm interested in discovering where you learned that successful business owners are "exploiting" people who willingly work for them.

Re: 80% of bosses say they regret earlier return-to-office plans

#422

Post by pharmakom »

mattgreenrocks wrote: post #392
catmanjan wrote: post #338

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it really possible for an individual to “build wealth” without exploiting the working class

Save 50% of your gross salary, invest in index funds, and be patient. You can speed up the process via geo-arbitrage, climbing the career ladder without lifestyle creep, working at a FAANG, being more frugal, or side hustles. Search for FIRE for more details. It’s not easy by any stretch.

Let's be honest, it's only possible for people with rare skills and/or prestigious credentials (which are largely a function of your parents social class).

Earning median wage most of that goes towards rent. There's nothing left to save. Move further away and you lose big on earnings.

Re: 80% of bosses say they regret earlier return-to-office plans

#423

Post by pharmakom »

usaar333 wrote: post #396
LapsangGuzzler wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think it’s really a conspiracy theory, this a fundamental aspect of American capitalism. Health insurance is a perfect example of a carrot that companies want to maintain control over in order to maintain a dedicated workforce. By keeping “affordable” (eye roll) access to healthcare tied to a full time job, they keep butts in seats. This isn’t new or isolated to tech companies. It’s always been about maintain…

Healthcare is just another cost in your life and you should view the benefit as part of your TC. It's only slightly distorted here in that companies can use pretax money but it isn't like it's a small expense to companies either. I've personally never used Cobra, because it is in fact cheaper to buy individual plans.

Ironically making it pretax harms employees long term by making them more dependent on the employer for healthcare

Re: 80% of bosses say they regret earlier return-to-office plans

#424

Post by pharmakom »

throwaway892238 wrote: post #60

I decided I will never again work in an office, for the rest of my life. It's a lifestyle choice. I refuse to put up with the B.S. anymore. I'm lucky that I've had a long career and my skills are very much in demand, so I will always be able to find a remote job somewhere. People doing jobs with more qualified candidates in the pool will probably have a harder time, and that sucks. For them, I hope they can band toge…

How does it benefit the suits? what you just described is lower cost and higher productivity under WFH

Re: 80% of bosses say they regret earlier return-to-office plans

#425

Post by ghaff »

HWR_14 wrote: post #138
troupe wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find it funny that when people were required to be home, employers talked about what great productivity they were getting with people at home. Then when it isn't required anymore, they want everyone back in the office for...productivity. My guess is that most employers really have no way to measure if an employee is being productive or not so managers are just reporting what makes them look good...and now we are ba…

Public statements about productivity are rarely negative. No one wants to hire a business with lazy workers who might not fulfill their contract. So public statements have to be positive.

It's reasonable to think in retrospect that, even assuming companies had reasonable measures of productivity and related metrics (which is by no means a given), OF COURSE during the pandemic, they were going to make statements to the effect that "everything is fine/better than we expected."

And, even from a somewhat less cynical perspective, it's reasonable to see a more complicated picture where many things, but not all things, are indeed more or less OK. Overlaid on this is that a lot of companies have cut back on travel etc. budgets so one of the alternatives to people getting together in local offices is at least somewhat off the table.

Re: 80% of bosses say they regret earlier return-to-office plans

#426

Post by stodor89 »

PeterStuer wrote: post #261
userbinator wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only real reason for open offices is cost saving. Everything else is just an excuse to make it not seem like it is.

Empire builders love to see and display their footsodiers. Nothing like sweeping a gaze over a big plateau with a few 100 serves to affirm your confidence.

Yeah, I think people often underestimate the role of ego in this kind of stuff. Hell, it can even be used as a philosophical razor: Never attribute to necessity that which is adequately explained by egomania.

Re: 80% of bosses say they regret earlier return-to-office plans

#427

Post by xwdv »

csomar wrote: post #208
closeparen wrote: post #153

I have a new conspiracy theory on RTO in Big Tech. Much has been said about commercial real estate. But I think getting highly capable people to work hard for you is a difficult problem & something tech executives put a lot of thought into. If you don't pay people enough, someone else will. But if you pay them too much, they'll become financially independent. Mid six figures is an objectively life-changing amount of…

It's not a conspiracy theory, it's how the system works. You are taxed on pretty much all of your income either from the state, the landlord, the credit card company or the lifestyle obligations that stems from the area you are living in. > And that's right where they want you. This is the part where we diverge, and I think where people confuse emerging phenomena for conspiracy. There is no one orchestrating this.

> There is no one orchestrating this.

There wasn’t before.

There is now.

Lobbyists are pushing for it. Big investment firms like Vanguard and Blackrock that have a lot to lose if the commercial real estate market collapses are pushing companies to mandate RTO policies if they want to keep getting investments. Makes sense.

Re: 80% of bosses say they regret earlier return-to-office plans

#428

Post by cyberlurker »

xmcqdpt2 wrote: post #355
cyberlurker wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yea that makes no sense. Maybe during the pandemic it made sense when daycares were closed down and people were worried about the health risks. But now, there is no way you can tend to a kid and be a productive remote employee at the same time.

I'm a relatively young parent and I've had (childless) friends tell me similar things. Some people don't understand how much work it is to keep a 4 year old entertained. The article funnily mentions "pet or child care", with EY handing out 800$ per year for it. What's 800$ of childcare, like two weeks? One week?

Based on what I know, $800 is roughly two weeks depending on where you live. A full month at $1600 is not unreasonable for an 8 hour work day, 5 days a week at a reasonably good daycare. It can be perhaps as much as $600 lower a month in low cost areas and hundreds higher in major metro areas. This is for one kid.

But these costs are dwarfed by hiring a legal nanny for watching a single kid. To do it legally in most states requires making them a full time employee with benefits and insurance, which I suppose is nice and all except it makes the entire thing unaffordable for even upper middle class incomes. So of course plenty of people do it under the table, which has its own set of problems.

Childcare and modern parenting is actually fascinating and depressing. The answer tends to be money and/or leaning on family.

Also the government does some kind of tax savings account for daycare expenses but the total amount falls far short of enough to cover services for a full time job. An obvious policy tweak would be to do a means tested daycare spending account with caps that reflect realistic full time jobs and help low income folk. The current one is a joke.

Back on topic: an underrated benefit of WFH is you can set your own hours with some clever time management with a partner. A parent can get up early and do work, have the other parent drop the kid at daycare, and then the first parent can pickup the kid from daycare so the second parent can work longer. And there can be trading of time between the parents to accommodate deadlines. Having to physically go into an office on a regular basis screws this entire system up. The forced nature of in-office work is something I will fight against as much as I can, even though I very much enjoy gathering with others to work in person when it makes sense.

Re: 80% of bosses say they regret earlier return-to-office plans

#429

Post by galangalalgol »

bluefirebrand wrote: post #384
johnnyanmac wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>it's still the result of human action, it's purposeful and intentional. Orcheastras imply a conductor, a central figure with the score to direct their symphony to play. 1000 conductors means there is no conductor. Each one may have a purpose and intention, but a conspiracy implies... well, conspiring. That isn't a conspiracy, it's a mob. Even if somehow the symphony manages to make a melody out of the madness, it's…

> 1000 conductors means there is no conductor. 1000 conductors means that there is 1000 conductors and 1000 orchestras. They've all done their research, and they've all independently decided to have their orchestras play mostly the same songs as all the other orchestras. They've arrived at this decision by copying what the most successful orchestras are doing, reading in orchestra magazines about best practice for or…

There is a word for it, stigmergy. It is just conspiracy minus the direct communication. A network where nodes each behave according to their observations rather than communicating. Termites don't conspire either.

Re: 80% of bosses say they regret earlier return-to-office plans

#430

Post by lucidguppy »

A portion of office space needs to become more fungible. Work office pods of 4-8 offices or desks that are lockable if needed.

Small satellite offices that don't need big commutes would probably bring in more people. I like the idea of a small office that I can come into if I want - I just HATE commuting. I also hate open office spaces - its anti productive.

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