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AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

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Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#421

Post by tinus_hn »

timr wrote: post #220
yifanl wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Drastic is relative to the expected impact of the application. There isn't much worse that can possibly happen to a bot-generated stream than having the stream taken down by the powers-that-be.

This is like saying that having something taken down by a mod on reddit is a "drastic consequence". I mean, sure...the content is removed, but in most cases, the reason for the action is subjective and somewhat arbitrary. To me, this is less a commentary on AI than on the absurd sensitivities of community moderation.

For many people Twitch streams are their primary source of income, this kind of ban can have quite a lot of impact. And then besides the ban there is the chilling effect because no one wants to skirt the rules and risk a ban. And that is what allows social justice warriors to dictate what others can make jokes about.

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#422

Post by [deleted] »

Levitz wrote: post #379
PartiallyTyped wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let us not forget certain fascists who claimed they’d outlaw all trans people and force them to detransition. Let us not forget how many trans people have died at the hands of bigots.

There is a certain irony to decrying attacks on trans ideology dogma as "fascism" while defending censorship. It is not through silence and imposition that healthy social order changes. Demands are made while little public discourse has even taken place and the more friction that creates the more those demanding feel vindicated, the more rejection fosters. It seems like rather than changing hearts, the trans movement…

[deleted]

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#423

Post by y-curious »

mjamesaustin wrote: post #219
twodave wrote: post #106

Uncharacteristically off-topic comment from me, I guess, but when do humans get to a point where we no longer have to appeal to the lowest common denominator? How are our relationships supposed to improve if we dub anything that makes us uncomfortable as "taboo" and steer clear of it? I get that on the Internet there is a lot of anonymity (though less than there used to be) that folks tend to abuse, but at the same t…

It's weird to talk about missing an element of human empathy regarding the topic of trans individuals, whose very existence is unacceptable to a broad swath of the population. 40% of transgender people have attempted suicide. The public dialogue around trans lives is one of very little empathy, respect, or civility. People are on this thread casually debating whether this joke "went to far" or not, while the people w…

>Would it have been OK to make a joke about 9/11 victims while they were still digging people out of the wreckage?

At what point do you feel like trans individuals will be "fair game" for humor? Or in your example, `no longer being pulled out of the wreckage`?

Comedians made 9/11 jokes within a year or 2 of the event.

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#424

Post by welshwelsh »

ben_w wrote: post #372
timr wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> merely being cancelled rather than straight up executed is why we live in the good times. Yes, "literally anything less than execution is OK" is the standard we should uphold for public discourse. This is like a joke that starts with "be grateful, comrade..."

Being cancelled is the smallest possible increment I am aware of over being heckled. It is the necessary other side of the same coin as freedom of speech, otherwise you end up with the literal Republican party being legally obligated to let the literal Communist Party of the USA (not a euphemism for the Democrats) lecture them during their Primaries.

>otherwise you end up with the literal Republican party being literally obligated to let the literal Communist Party of the USA lecture them during their primaries

And this is a bad thing how?

The purpose of free speech is to prevent groupthink. Nothing good comes from allowing Republicans and Communists to create echo chambers where people only hear opinions they already agree with and dissent is banned. Wouldn't it be more productive if they were forced to engage directly with their opponents, and made to justify their position to their harshest critics?

It would be better if there were no parties at all, and all political discourse happened in a public space where all viewpoints are represented indiscriminately.

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#425

Post by cmilton »

StanislavPetrov wrote: post #381
snet0 wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I agree with this in the abstract, this particular case is that of a private company refusing hosting to content that it (or, perhaps, its advertisers) does not want their name attached to. It'd be nice if we didn't have this situation, e.g. income not being tied directly to advertisers -> indirectly to LCD of opinion. I don't know if you were implying that Twitch ought not remove this content, but I just feel…

>this particular case is that of a private company refusing hosting to content I believe this argument holds water on some level, when it regards a small private company, but it is much less compelling when that "private company" is Amazon (who owns Twitch), Google, Twitter, Facebook or another behemoth with hundreds of millions of users. At that point, it becomes a very chilling attack on free speech, which is why I…

Correct.

What if the private company is Visa or Mastercard? What if it is your only ISP?

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#426

Post by Slighted »

xwdv wrote: post #113

[flagged]

Because they think of themselves as special snowflakes above criticism. Its absolutely fine if they make fun of "the straights", but the second you point out things like the word "gender" being coined by a pedophile called John Money whos human test subjects eventually both committed suicide, or that sending children to drag shows with very obvious sexual elements and undertones is evil, or that chopping off their penises or breasts won't help them and instead creates chronic illnesses and increases depression, you're literally the devil and deserve to be fired from your job, banned from social media, and if they had their way, sent to the mines.

We don't "validate" people suffering from schizophrenia by telling them that their trees are indeed talking to them about the little green aliens in their attic, so why "validate" other mental illnesses in similar ways?...

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#427

Post by GenerocUsername »

paganel wrote: post #222
gregsadetsky wrote: post #19

Explanation from their Discord (more info/links below) “Earlier tonight, we started having an outage using OpenAI’s GPT-3 Davinci model, which caused the show to exhibit errant behaviors (you may have seen empty rooms cycling through). OpenAI has a less sophisticated model, Curie, that was the predecessor to Davinci. When davinci started failing, we switched over to Curie to try to keep the show running without any d…

What’s “errant” about it? Lots of transphobic people around, if anything I’d say the AI was closer to “real life” than lots of other AI systems.

Would it have been transphobic if the sentence had been prefixed with 'some people say...'

At a certain level AI trained on inputs is just a big 'some people say' box.

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#428

Post by charcircuit »

rajup wrote: post #306

I can't find any details (at least in TFA), what exactly was this joke? I would not trust a private company's judgement on what is "offensive", given the innumerable instances of them proving incapable of accurate judgement of such a thing using automated systems.

"Anyone have any suggestions? I'm thinking about doing a bit about how being transgender is actually a mental illness. Or how all liberals are secretly gay and want to impose their will on everyone. Or something about how transgender people are ruining the fabric of society. But no one is laughing so I'm going to stop. Thanks for coming out to tonight. See you."

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#429

Post by rysertio »

Levitz wrote: post #277
causi wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Am I wrong in thinking that getting your feelings hurt by an AI making an offensive joke is the equivalent of thinking you've been doxxed when a random number generator spits out your phone number?

As dumb as twitch moderation can be, the issue is that you can't possibly task twitch moderation with knowing to which degree an offensive joke is relevant or not. If an AI is set up to spout something-phobic stuff 24/7 surely they are going to ban that, rather than wondering where is the degree of offensiveness that warrants a ban, they just ban when ToS is breached. At least that's what would make sense, and Twitch…

It sounds more like a dumb AI bot was banned by another dumber AI bot.

Re: AI Generated Seinfeld banned on Twitch for transphobic jokes

#430

Post by endtime »

mariodiana wrote: post #397
gregsadetsky wrote: post #19

Explanation from their Discord (more info/links below) “Earlier tonight, we started having an outage using OpenAI’s GPT-3 Davinci model, which caused the show to exhibit errant behaviors (you may have seen empty rooms cycling through). OpenAI has a less sophisticated model, Curie, that was the predecessor to Davinci. When davinci started failing, we switched over to Curie to try to keep the show running without any d…

So, I watched the clip, and honestly that sounds more Norm MacDonald than Jerry Seinfeld.

Definitely not Norm. Norm would (and did!) say he loved transgender people, and would leave ambiguous whether he was being candid. (Or he'd pretend to struggle with his love for transgenderism versus his distaste for "psychosexual sadists who slay people" - not looking it up but pretty sure that's an accurate quote. The joke of course being that he is confusing two different categories of people in a shocking way, playing up his clueless character.)

He liked bombing, but only with jokes he believed in. He wouldn't tell a meta-joke like this with such a lack of punchline.

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