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Apple Unveils M2

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Re: Apple Unveils M2

#421

Post by bartread »

furyg3 wrote: post #268
edgefield wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

100% agree. The last generation of MacBook pros with intel processors were virtually unusable for zoom calls or any intensive processing power tasks.

This is downvoted, but my intel MacBook Pro (maxed out specs) from 2015 really was dying on zoom / MS teams calls. Probably says a lot about those two apps, but this was one of the main reasons I upgraded to an M1 Mac during corona.

Same, and same spec machine (2015 15" maxxed out everything).

I did manage to make it handle Zoom just fine by opening it up and blowing it out with an air duster, which I've been doing about every 6 months since 2018 or so. The interior is a magnet for dust in a way that my Dell work laptop just isn't (even though that thing is a PoS in many other ways, most of which I suspect are down to Windows rather than the hardware).

After a periodic dusting it runs a whole lot better - no lag or dropped frames - even when the fans come on. It's still a nightmare for fan noise compared with my 2011 17" MBP (again, maxxed retail specs, but then replaced internal drive with SSD - which made it a new machine - and upgraded to 16GB RAM because you can replace at least some stuff in machines of this vintage), which then unfortunately died due to the GPU desoldering issue (I've already "fixed" it once by reflowing the solder, but this only held for a couple of weeks before it died again).

I think I'm going to wait for M2 MBPs and then splurge - hopefully get 7 years out of the new machine as well.

Re: Apple Unveils M2

#422

Post by Macha »

babypuncher wrote: post #92
threeseed wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their answer is this: https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2022/05/microsoft-will-boost... They will need to get developers up to speed porting their apps to ARM before they are even in a position to re-boot their Windows ARM strategy. But this is a multi-year journey which is likely to give Intel/AMD time to produce something more competitive.

Even if that happens, I'm not sure how much appeal an ARM version of Windows actually has. Right now, the only things keeping me on Windows are Visual Studio and my huge library of legacy software ( ahem video games). Microsoft's x86 emulation on ARM is downright atrocious. A native ARM version of Visual Studio could keep me productive, but I'm not about to spend money on a new computer than runs all my favorite old…

Microsoft has made three seperate attempts at windows on ARM (Windows RT, Windows 10 for ARM, Windows 10 S). Whether because each attempt produced a more locked down platform than standard windows, or because people prefer compatibility with their existing software over battery life, or because non-M1 ARM chips were not competitive with Intel/AMD even before emulation overhead, none of these attempts took off

Re: Apple Unveils M2

#423

Post by bartread »

theodric wrote: post #328
furyg3 wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is downvoted, but my intel MacBook Pro (maxed out specs) from 2015 really was dying on zoom / MS teams calls. Probably says a lot about those two apps, but this was one of the main reasons I upgraded to an M1 Mac during corona.

Yeah, same, that's why I resorted to water-cooling :) https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/so-i-water-cooled-my-ma... It's pretty much silent now, even with the CPU governor pegged to max.

Thank you! I've been looking for a water-cooled laptop solution. I've tried the fan based laptop coolers and they're basically a waste of time (plus they add to fan noise). This is what I wanted. Nobody sells it, but I don't mind a bit of fabbing.

Re: Apple Unveils M2

#424

Post by [deleted] »

smlacy wrote: post #358
corrral wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A major factor in achieving excellent battery life coupled with relatively good performance & responsiveness, on Apple products, is the OS. That holds for both Macs and iDevices.

So you're saying that BSD has better power management than Linux? Would love to see some real research and analysis on this.

[deleted]

Re: Apple Unveils M2

#425

Post by skavi »

CodeBeater wrote: post #409
skavi wrote: post #392

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple reused the exact same Intel chassis for their previous generation M1 MacBook Air and Pro 13”.

Sans the "contactless" cooling I'm assuming?

Sans the fan actually [0]. Yes, the cooling system got worse for the M1 Air.

The new slightly thicker Pros are great, but their chassis’ are not a significant factor in how they perform relative to the old Intel models.

The new M2 Air is the thinnest an Air has ever been. I bet it will perform excellently as well.

[0]: https://www.ifixit.com/News/46884/m1-macbook-teardowns-somet...

Re: Apple Unveils M2

#426

Post by Macha »

runevault wrote: post #278
jcstauffer wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Windows may still dominate, but 75% is far below the 90% it was 10 years ago, while MacOS has nearly doubled in the same timeframe. As someone who can remember this never changing, that's a pretty steep slope...

Oh it is far from nothing to be certain. And as Netflix's recent loss of subscribers and subsequent drop in stock price showed nothing is forever. But I'd still need to see the drop continue for a bit longer before I full on expect Microsoft to be in trouble. Mind you, I would like to see them follow in Apple's footsteps on the train the M1 is creating. It certainly makes it FEEL like there is more runway down this p…

I think at this point Windows market share could go to 0, and while it'd hurt, with Office 365, Azure, Xbox, etc., I think microsoft is sufficiently diversified to survive that.

Re: Apple Unveils M2

#427

Post by Macha »

freediver wrote: post #71
runevault wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quick Google search indicates Windows still holds a 74% market share. Apple has a long way to go before they are really crunching on Windows in the general market. Hardware superiority does not guarantee success, for many people what they are already comfortable with is fine.

I assume what you refer to is this https://www.statista.com/statistics/218089/global-market-sha... If you look at the trend, macOS is gaining worldwide market share while Windows is steadily dropping. And macOS share in USA has already reached close to 25%.

Right, but for Apple to gain share in the rest of world like they have in the US, they need to drop prices, and that'd hurt their margins, including in the US if enough people buy cheaper foreign macs (which is definitely a thing, in my western european country there's a couple of somewhat popular retailers selling imported US laptops which are cheaper than local SKUs)

Re: Apple Unveils M2

#428

Post by mathstuf »

lostlogin wrote: post #216
mathstuf wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like the XPS 13 line myself. The 93xx line lasted all night when I forgot to shut the lid one evening (9+ hours) with Fedora (after running `powertop` and doing its tweaks). But I'm also a "weirdo" who doesn't like Apple-made hardware (the trackpad, touchbar, keyboard, mouse, etc. are all inferior IMO), so maybe you're looking for something different there.

What are you after in a trackpad? I think this is the best feature of the laptops.

I am rough with mine (my first uses were on some IBM tank from the late 80s/early 90s when I was young and a Lenovo T61 in college). Spurious clicks and taps happen all the time when I end up using the things. I have spent minutes trying to get an Apple trackpad to perform to drag and drop and instead having it do every other thing from extra clicks on the way to zooming to running out of space when I get to the edge trying to get where I'm going. The fact that you can SSH in and use a more exacting interface is the best feature of the things IMO, but sometimes the UI is just the only way to get something done.

I also liked the matte texture of the ThinkPad, but I think that era is over (the XPS isn't glassy like Apple's at least, but still lacks texture).

Re: Apple Unveils M2

#429

Post by Reason077 »

drno123 wrote: post #266
smoldesu wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Counterpoint: M2 is a tock release, not a tick. This is pretty much the same behavior that ended up getting Intel shot in the foot: leaning too heavily on marginal performance increases from process enhancement will bite you in the butt when your competitors get their tech on your node. Intel and AMD are both going to be on 5nm in 2023, Apple should be pretty worried if this is what they're fighting with. 3nm isn't e…

My understanding is that 3nm for Apple is coming in 2023. https://www.slashgear.com/833760/apples-3nm-processor-is-abo...

Coming in 2022 for the iPhone 14 Pro line.

Re: Apple Unveils M2

#430

Post by mathstuf »

rolisz wrote: post #350
mathstuf wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like the XPS 13 line myself. The 93xx line lasted all night when I forgot to shut the lid one evening (9+ hours) with Fedora (after running `powertop` and doing its tweaks). But I'm also a "weirdo" who doesn't like Apple-made hardware (the trackpad, touchbar, keyboard, mouse, etc. are all inferior IMO), so maybe you're looking for something different there.

My XPS 13 9360 randomly turns on when the lid is closed and burns through the battery. There was an official document at some point saying that if you put it in your backpack in sleep mode, it voids the warranty. I really like the laptop otherwise, but battery/power management is utter crap on it, both on Windows and on Linux.

I've noticed this too, but it seems Bluetooth related. There's a report with the Linux kernel, but no progress as yet.

See this thread: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31521995

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