Shaving is an example of how consumer products extract more money • Hacker News Board

Re: Shaving is an example of how consumer products extract more money

#421

Post by thayne » Sat, May 07, 2022, 4:02 PM UTC

gruez wrote: post #158

>Other examples of products that seem to exhibit a similar trend, where purported convenience leads to higher prices >Cooking equipment: essentially indestructible Cast Iron skillets transition into teflon pans. The newer pans perform worse, and must be replaced on a shockingly regular basis. They also seem to be poisonous. They have their uses. I wouldn't try frying eggs in a cast iron, for instance (technically you…

> smart TVs are cheaper than dumb TVs because they're subsidized by ad revenue.

What if you count having to view ads, and having the tv spy on you as a cost? RN,for many TVs you can just not connect to wifi, but how long until the TV won't work unless it is connected?

> Also, the claim itself doesn't really make any sense. Even if you stop getting software updates, that doesn't prevent you from using it as a dumb display.

Perhaps a better argument is that a bad software can brick the TV, or the components of the smart functionality break in a way that prevents you from using it as a dumb tv (i.e. it has more "moving parts"), and if you don't use the smart functionality, then it is a waste of the materials to make those components, and probably electricity running through the circuits. And it isn't too hard to imagine a future where the tv just stops working if it can't phone home.

Re: Shaving is an example of how consumer products extract more money

#422

Post by ARandomerDude » Sat, May 07, 2022, 4:03 PM UTC

jader201 wrote: post #398

Why is a thread on electric razors not the top comment on a post about the expense/waste of straight razors? I get that they have some downsides, but if we’re talking about the expense/waste of straight razors, then it would make sense to consider electric razors. I’ve seen so many ads about companies trying to “invent” the most effective, lowest cost straight razor and it still confuses me, given we already have ele…

And I never cut myself or get razor burn with an electric razor. I also don't have to worry about running out of shaving cream or whether my shaving cream is too big to pack on an airplane.

I switched to electric years ago and will never go back.

Re: Shaving is an example of how consumer products extract more money

#423

Post by callamdelaney » Sat, May 07, 2022, 4:03 PM UTC

Modern 'razors' are a scam. You don't need 2 blades, 3 or even 4. One blade will do the job better than any combination of gillette rubbish and for a much lower cost.

I would recommend investing in a decent safety razor - which will last forever if well cared for. ($40-80 range). Then your razors run about $0.20 each for good ones purchased in bulk.

edit: I now see that safety razors are the point of the article.. great minds?

Re: Shaving is an example of how consumer products extract more money

#424

Post by tomjen3 » Sat, May 07, 2022, 4:03 PM UTC

eckesicle wrote: post #75

My dad never taught me how to shave, and for the longest time I just used these disposable Gillette style blades, and got terrible results. Missed spots, cuts and skin infections. At some point I decided to do some research and settled on double edge disposable blades. I've never been happier, and feel much better about my skin too. These are the products I use: * A wooden synthetic shaving brush (I felt bad about th…

I made the mistake of doing something like that, but you can totally use foam in a can which lasts a long time and is much more convinient and, for me, better and use that in a combination with a safety razor.

Re: Shaving is an example of how consumer products extract more money

#425

Post by xyzzyz » Sat, May 07, 2022, 4:04 PM UTC

hedora wrote: post #300

bluedino wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Overheated Teflon. Not egg cooking temps

At regular cooking temps, the chemicals still leach into the food. Also, you should throw a teflon pan out if it has a single scratch, since it leaches much more rapidly after that.

I don’t think Teflon leaches into food at normal cooking temperatures (it’s a very stable chemical), but even if it did, it’s totally fine, as Teflon is biologically inert. It is used in medicine for implants, catheter linings etc.

Re: Shaving is an example of how consumer products extract more money

#426

Post by lolinder » Sat, May 07, 2022, 4:04 PM UTC

gruez wrote: post #158

>Other examples of products that seem to exhibit a similar trend, where purported convenience leads to higher prices >Cooking equipment: essentially indestructible Cast Iron skillets transition into teflon pans. The newer pans perform worse, and must be replaced on a shockingly regular basis. They also seem to be poisonous. They have their uses. I wouldn't try frying eggs in a cast iron, for instance (technically you…

> I wouldn't try frying eggs in a cast iron, for instance (technically you can, but it requires an absurd amount of oil).

We fry our eggs every morning on a cast iron skillet with a tiny amount of oil (This is one of the biggest contributors to teflon's mythology: you can't preheat a teflon pan safely (it ruins the coating), so people learn to not preheat. They then get frustrated when using other pans that things stick that wouldn't have on their teflon.

(Edit: the skillet is a cheap, unaltered Lodge, nothing antique or sanded.)

Re: Shaving is an example of how consumer products extract more money

#427

Post by gruez » Sat, May 07, 2022, 4:04 PM UTC

tristor wrote: post #378

gruez wrote: post #158

>Other examples of products that seem to exhibit a similar trend, where purported convenience leads to higher prices >Cooking equipment: essentially indestructible Cast Iron skillets transition into teflon pans. The newer pans perform worse, and must be replaced on a shockingly regular basis. They also seem to be poisonous. They have their uses. I wouldn't try frying eggs in a cast iron, for instance (technically you…

> Also, claiming that they "seem to be poisonous" without any qualifiers is a little misleading. To my knowledge they're only poisonous during manufacturing (ie. the precursor chemicals) and when they get too hot. 1. The manufacturing process results in those precursor chemicals entering urban water supplies where they are nearly impossible to filter out (only RO is effective and it's not even 100% effective), and on…

>1. The manufacturing process results in those precursor chemicals entering urban water supplies where they are nearly impossible to filter out (only RO is effective and it's not even 100% effective), and once in the bloodstream of people are powerful endrocrine disruptors which circulate and are filtered slowly by the kidneys... and when peed out go right back into the water supply due to not being able to be removed during treatment. These "forever chemicals" are some of the most health damaging pollutants in the West.

That's why I said it was "a little misleading" rather that outright false. "poisonous" sort of implies that the object itself is poisonous or is bad for you. I'm sure manufacturing a smartphone causes a bunch of environmental damage, but you wouldn't call it poisonous (outside of putting in in your mouth).

>2. Teflon is extremely hazardous when consumed and it flakes off of the pans over time (which is why they must be replaced often) or when incorrect utensils are used (common among unsophisticated users).

source? This is contradicted by https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polytetrafluoroethylene#Safety

>3. Teflon can overheat on a standard consumer stove using standard cooking techniques. You actually need different techniques to prevent overheating a Teflon pan.

Like I said in my initial comment, teflon has its uses. I'm not saying it's the best tool for every job. Given that, I highly doubt this applies if I'm just cooking my eggs.

>4. Cast Iron is effectively non-stick after enough use, and you can absolutely fry an egg in it without sticking if you have a smooth-bottom pan (either a vintage cast iron, new vintage-style, or a new style that you've sanded down and seasoned yourself).

Sounds like a lot of work to me. In other words, the teflon pan is actually more convenient.

Re: Shaving is an example of how consumer products extract more money

#428

Post by [deleted] » Sat, May 07, 2022, 4:06 PM UTC

gruez wrote: post #158

>Other examples of products that seem to exhibit a similar trend, where purported convenience leads to higher prices >Cooking equipment: essentially indestructible Cast Iron skillets transition into teflon pans. The newer pans perform worse, and must be replaced on a shockingly regular basis. They also seem to be poisonous. They have their uses. I wouldn't try frying eggs in a cast iron, for instance (technically you…

[deleted]

Re: Shaving is an example of how consumer products extract more money

#429

Post by lobocinza » Sat, May 07, 2022, 4:06 PM UTC

CoastalCoder wrote: post #48

motohagiography wrote: post #11

I've used a straight razor for almost 20 years. Vindicating to read that the price of a Dovo pays for itself. I think my bar of shaving soap is probably the better part of decade old as well. In the interim, a whole peculiar subculture around shaving has developed, but you don't have to be a part of it to just use a razor. Makes you unreachable by corporate marketing as well, which is itself its own reward.

Aside from differences in cost, do you find anything about a straight razor compellingly better than e.g. a Gillette Mach 3? I go through Mach 3 cartridges pretty slowly, so price isn't a big concern. And I don't notice anything deficient about the quality of my shaves. But one thing I really like about safety razors is that there's zero risk of serious injury.

It shaves deeper so you can have a better shave or shave less frequently. It's also a lot quicker than using a Mach3.

Re: Shaving is an example of how consumer products extract more money

#430

Post by dghlsakjg » Sat, May 07, 2022, 4:06 PM UTC

sandworm101 wrote: post #231

caymanjim wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I wouldn't try frying eggs in a cast iron, for instance (technically you can, but it requires an absurd amount of oil). You need to learn how to season and care for cast iron. It doesn't take an absurd amount of oil, and the egg should slide out with ease.

>> season and care for cast iron So they need more work and skill than other pans. In other words: they are in fact less convenient . Cast iron also has multiple issues when used with induction ranges, which are by far the most efficient/environmental cookers.

I find that the amount of knowledge and effort to "care" for a cast iron pan is overestimated.

I treat mine no differently than any other pan and do all of the things that I do to any other frying pan. I wash it with soap and the scratchy side of the sponge, I store it with no oil, I cook acidic sauces, I let it soak in the sink, etc...

The seasoning is fine, once I accidentally left it on the burner and it burnt off the seasoning (something that would have destroyed any teflon pan). I just used a little extra oil the next few times.

I haven't used it extensively with an induction burner, but I don't have any complaints....