421–430 of 571 posts
The bay area svelte group is looking for a new moderator, I was going to do it, but after this experience I decided I will just wait until something better than svelte comes along.
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I've not used any Svelte significantly yet, so your points may stand. I have, however, written React for years. If anything in Svelte is more confusing to juniors than how useEffect works, especially in conjunction with unstable references, I would be literally amazed. useEffect is a loaded automatic pointed at your face if you don't fully understand it. It is truly a terrible API due to how intimately you have to un…
Agree 100%. The migration from componentDidMount, componentDidUpdate, etc to useEffect was a major regression in terms of readability. The return function in useEffect vs. componentWillUnmount is just terrible. This is always a bizarre topic for juniors.
This is such amazing news! Betting on Svelte was the best thing ever for both my career and sanity. I'm now heavily involved in the Svelte community and next Saturday we'll be hosting our fourth conference solely dedicated to Svelte. If you're interested in checking it out the URL is here, it's free and will be streamed on YouTube: https://sveltesummit.com There are also two watch parties that will be hosted in New Y…
I'm tired of having to learn yet another templating language without a very compelling reason. Why do I have to learn, what is essentially, a new programming language for each of these frameworks (Angular, Svelte, Vue, React... Do I really need to learn yet another language construct for stuff like `loops`, `if/else`, event handlers...etc. Why must all of these frameworks re-invent the wheel? At least with React it i…
The problem with each of these frameworks is that they make the mistake of surfacing the underlying standards like HTML and the DOM. This is why they look remarkably similar and can only possibly be incrementally better, at best. HTML and the DOM are still essentially modeled on static documents. Building apps that deal directly with these standards is an impedance mismatch that, remarkably, people keep trying to sol…
I have recently joined a team that had invested in Svelte. I had previous experience in Angular and React. I was happy with React, but I decided to drink the koolaid and go all-in and do my best with Svelte. 6 months later, we're moving to React. It is partly because our Svelte code was messy enough to warrant a rewrite, and partly because we wanted to leverage the React ecosystem in that rewrite. It was also partly…
> - Special syntax for reactivity is not javascript > - I find the javascript-native flexibility of JSX far more expressive than any custom templating These are odd points to combine – JSX is special syntax not JavaScript as well.
More on point, being constrained within the special language is miles away from the constraint of JSX, which is essentially limited to only allowing expressions, because the macro expands to expressions. Everything else is fair game, and that makes it far more expressive.
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For all the use cases I deal with on a regular basis, Svelte looks more like vanilla HTML/JS than any equivalent React code. And the reason these things change is because that's what needed changing . One of the topline features of Svelte is that is has less boilerplate than React, and it achieves that quite handily. Unless you're criticizing particular constructs in Svelte that are unjustifiably different, I don't t…
What how can you say that??? {myItems.map({id, title}) => {title} } vs... svelte {#each myItems as item} {item.title} {/each} One is literally just javascript and html the other is an entirely different template language. You might say... JSX is not HTML... well it's very very similar... If you know HTML you JSX is very intuitive.
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Agree 100%. The migration from componentDidMount, componentDidUpdate, etc to useEffect was a major regression in terms of readability. The return function in useEffect vs. componentWillUnmount is just terrible. This is always a bizarre topic for juniors.
Why do you think it's terrible?
Compared to an explicit method name it is much less intuitive.
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And yet Svelte is faster than React in pretty much every benchmark I’ve seen.
That makes sense though right? One would assume that shadow dom and dom would be slower than direct dom manipulation.
I have recently joined a team that had invested in Svelte. I had previous experience in Angular and React. I was happy with React, but I decided to drink the koolaid and go all-in and do my best with Svelte. 6 months later, we're moving to React. It is partly because our Svelte code was messy enough to warrant a rewrite, and partly because we wanted to leverage the React ecosystem in that rewrite. It was also partly…
Perhaps a shift in mindset about how to approach using Svelte would help. Svelte is not React, and using React for an extended period really changes how you think about frontend code (structure-wise etc). As a quick example, the Svelte 'ecosystem' is simply the Javascript ecosystem, which existed well before React. You can import any npm module to a Svelte app. Outside of the React-specific packages (which I argue ar…
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Agree 100%. The migration from componentDidMount, componentDidUpdate, etc to useEffect was a major regression in terms of readability. The return function in useEffect vs. componentWillUnmount is just terrible. This is always a bizarre topic for juniors.
Why do you think it's terrible?
And don't even get me started about the dependencies array, which has different behaviour whether you omit the argument, or pass an empty array, or pass actual `useState` dependencies, or pass other unrelated variables. Again, it's something you just "need to memorize" to use React.