.NET 6 Released • Hacker News Board

Re: .NET 6 Released

#421

Post by to11mtm » Thu, Nov 11, 2021, 4:30 AM UTC

fpig wrote: post #406

to11mtm wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In all fairness, at one point you could actually make sense of things. Unless I'm misremembering, until recently Avalonia was still being touted as primarily a replacement for Desktop WPF. I was shocked to see they're talking about mobile now too. I guess it's somewhat expected. Uno basically does what MAUI does. The main difference being, Uno has been around for a while longer and something you've been able to use f…

> Microsoft's UI story is a non-starter until they get back to the point that a user can: Why do you care about this stuff? I don't understand. Surely most developers can build a simple app with a few buttons easily in whichever framework they're using. This stuff doesn't really matter for I'd dare to say 90% of developers. What matters is how hard it is to build and maintain complicated stuff. And there WPF blew Win…

> What matters is how hard it is to build and maintain complicated stuff.

What matters is how hard it is to deliver a product to the end users. As I gave in my personal user story, yeah, I had to eventually pay the piper and refactor significantly to make sure things were maintainable. But it was a good lesson learned, and I've met many other developers over the years who got hooked on C# in a similar way.

> And there WPF blew WinForms (and VB6) out of the water.

WPF would be fine for this scenario. If we could do things like this at a WPF level of designer I'd be happy. It's got a little more of a cognitive load to get started but long term is easier to reason about long term and from a conceptual standpoint is more transferable to other contexts (i.e. Web MVVM Frameworks.)

I haven't looked at Avalonia in it's current state (last time I gave it a peek, it was still in a 'almost-ready' status) but if they really are able to do multiplatform as I see they say now then perhaps that's what I'm saying is needed. (Which may be more of a statement on the state of Real OSS Awareness in the .NET community.)

Definitely will give it a go, since I know it's supposed to be a replacement for WPF so I'm hoping(?) that the existing tooling out there is usable

Re: .NET 6 Released

#422

Post by sylens » Thu, Nov 11, 2021, 6:13 PM UTC

dustinmoris wrote: post #72

dschuessler wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft branding is terrible. My only point of contact with it is Visual Studio Code which is different from Visual Studio which is different from Visual Studio for Mac. There was a brief period of time after I recognized that .NET really works on all platforms without proprietary stuff and before the `dotnet watch` desaster in which I was at least curious about .NET. But even then I never fully figured out how .NE…

> Microsoft branding is terrible. Agreed. > I never fully figured out how .NET, .NET Core, ASP.NET, .NET Framework, .NET MAUI and the kitchen sink relate to each other. You're not the only one who is massively confused about everything that is labelled .NET or Core. If anyone else is struggling, I recommend this (I wrote it): https://dusted.codes/dotnet-basics

Just wanted to say thank you for the write-up, it helped bring me up to speed on the state of dotnet as I am looking to get back into it

Re: .NET 6 Released

#423

Post by Lord_Zero » Fri, Nov 12, 2021, 4:06 PM UTC

mmpdev wrote: post #156

> System.Linq — DistinctBy/UnionBy/IntersectBy/ExceptBy I'm excited by having these built in. I always found it awkward to need to do: `.GroupBy(item => item.Property).Select(group => group.First())`.

I have been using https://morelinq.github.io/ for a long time for all the above and more.

Re: .NET 6 Released

#424

Post by metaltyphoon » Sat, Nov 13, 2021, 9:55 PM UTC

Semaphor wrote: post #330

metaltyphoon wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crazy how bing.com seem to not care for "beta" software :D

They literally don’t. They run actual preview versions in production to give the .NET team a chance to test new releases in high-traffic production scenarios. Though IIRC preview is a bit past beta ;)

Right… So if such a massive site uses it whats the excuse for the next CRUD app?

Re: .NET 6 Released

#425

Post by elAhmo » Sun, Nov 14, 2021, 4:10 PM UTC

osigurdson wrote: post #198

We recently got through upgrading a large code base from .NET framework to .NET core 3.1. It was quite challenging as it seemed to touch every corner of .NET including AppDomains, .NET remoting, serializing type information, C++ interop which requires environment variables to be set in process (that one is very obscure), etc, etc. In any case, the performance results were really outstanding (particularly vs Mono) esp…

Would you mind sharing how long the upgrade took, did it require a lot of changes?

I am wondering about jumping from relatively large codebase in .NET Core 3.1 to 6.

Re: .NET 6 Released

#426

Post by naasking » Wed, Nov 17, 2021, 5:11 PM UTC

FpUser wrote: post #397

naasking wrote: post #395

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 1) I use leak detection tool so no productivity gain in that area. These are never as good as garbage collection. In some cases, not even close.

I consider this statement false

Consider it false all you like, the proof is in the pudding:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2021/11/16/google-c...

Re: .NET 6 Released

#427

Post by Tozen » Wed, Nov 17, 2021, 7:31 PM UTC

abdusco wrote: post #328

TylerE wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds like you want nim.

Yeah, nim ticks all the boxes, but the ecosystem around it should grow a bit more until I can develop comfortably with it. vlang[0] also seems like a nice golang "fork" that I'd be willing to spend time on. [0]: https://github.com/vlang/v/blob/master/doc/docs.md

As a personal choice, would rather use Vlang than Nim. Like the potential and what I'm seeing from Vlang, though was hoping the cross-platform UI would be further along. As it is, they are developing quite quickly.

Re: .NET 6 Released

#428

Post by snorremd » Thu, Nov 18, 2021, 8:27 AM UTC

mmgutz wrote: post #284

UglyToad wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perceived cool factor, I think. Both .NET/C# and Java are the core of Dark Matter Development [0]. They're what a huge chunk of developers and enterprise actually use but they're not cool and they don't get blogged about. Obviously the history of EEE and Windows only legacy means there's a lot of hostility to anything .NET specifically amongst a subpopulation of developers. However I don't think it sufficiently expla…

Don't think it's just about coolness. In .NET there is usually one way to do things, the MS way. You don't have options. Whatever MS prescribes is practiced by most enterprise shops. I remember arguing for something closer to MVC (several open source solutions) when ASP.NET forms was the way to do things. It wasn't until ASP.NET MVC came out that enterprise shops came on board. I still see a lot of documentation that…

I needed to learn dotnet for my new job, and I use MacOS and Linux when developing. Took a course on dotnet and entity framework, and when it came time to set up the database stuff of course both the tutorial and documentation on the official dotnet framework page showed instructions specifically for Visual Studio. Had to do some googling and reading GitHub issues to find the command line solution.

When the .Net Foundation was announcing that they were going to drop the hotreload support from dotnet watch in favour of supporting it in the Visual Studio editor I was again reminded of how (some parts of) MSFT think that dotnet should still be a fully integrated development platform for Windows, rather than a multi platform, open community and open source project. I guess there might be some internal power struggle there between various business interests.

There are already more Linux VMs on Azure than there are Windows VMs. And if they still insist on making the dotnet experience on Linux and MacOS subpar compared to Windows they will very quickly find that people who develop for these OSs will move towards Java or other languages and frameworks with better support for these operating systems.