And this kind of thing is exactly why you should never trust the cloud.
An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology
421–430 of 713 posts
Re: An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology
#422Earlier quoted context omitted.
They scan things I send them. They don't (publicly announce that they) scan things on my device.
The Apple feature discussed here is for photos being synched to iCloud Photos. It does not scan arbitrary local content.
They already can decrypt iCloud photos, why else perform an on-device scan ? If not with the intention to scan all local contents ?
Re: An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology
#423Where is Richard Stallman when you need him? This is the War on General Computation you have been warned about, and its good to reiterate: "You ( and I mean you as an Individual and you as a Company ) you are either with us, or against us"
> Where is Richard Stallman when you need him? He was canceled, but he still regularly updates his personal website: https://stallman.org/
i mean. he did warn everyone that this is going to happen decades ago.
chiming is on this would just give the cancel mob more ammunition
Re: An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology
#424Earlier quoted context omitted.
The privacy implications are fucking horrible. As an Android user I'd love to gloat, after all Apple have really had the upper edge on privacy so far, and their users have not been shy about telling us. Again and again. However any pleasure would be as short lived as peeing your pants to keep warm in winter, because if Apple proceeds, Google is bound to follow. A user monitoring system like this is just ripe for abus…
Google Photos runs PhotoDNA on all photos there, so it’s no different from Apple scanning photos destined for iCloud photos with similar tech. I guess the only pushback is that apple has decided to do it on-device (still only to photos going to iCloud Photos) instead of server-side, where they have to disable E2EE to do so?
There's a huge difference between Apple scanning files that are on Apple's servers and Apple putting spyware on your encrypted device.
Re: An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology
#425So the M1 has turned me off of Apple products because, quite frankly, I don't want to spend (more) of my time fixing shit a trillion dollar company broke and doesn't care to fix. This though, this will be the nail in the coffin with my 25 year relationship to Apple. I probably wouldn't even have batted an eye at it to be honest, iff, Apple hadn't been selling me on the idea that their platform is "private and secure.…
I have absolutely no comment on Apple that you or anyone else hasn’t made. Except your comments about hash matching, the whole point is it goes to manual confirmation, they don’t just detect an illegal hash and come arrest you.
But do you seriously think this isn’t going to be the standard for Android, Windows, ChromeOS, OSX, etc coming at degrees of time or implementation?
I know all the Android people are just thinking “I can root” or “I’ll run Lineage” which is well and good but relatively no one else will.
Stomping your feet and saying No More Apple For Me is not a winner here. It needs to be worse than that for them. What that looks like? I’m just as clueless as anyone else.
Re: An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology
#426Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Should the internet be a free for all place without moderation? The better question would be: do you want an arbitrary person (like me) to decide whether you have a right to send an arbitrary pack of bytes? Neither "society" nor "voters" nor "corporations" make these decisions. It is always an arbitrary person who does. Should one person surrender his agency into the hands of another?
>Neither "society" nor "voters" nor "corporations" make these decisions. It is always an arbitrary person who does. Except in this case, a corporation (Apple) is making the decision relative to the sexual mores of modern Western society and the child pornography laws of the United States. It's unlikely this decision was made and implemented randomly by a single "arbitrary" individual. Contrary to your claim, it's nev…
"Apple has the right to decide how you use their product"
I hate this argument. If Apple wants to claim ownership of _their_ products then they shouldn't sell them. They should lease them.
Re: An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology
#427Earlier quoted context omitted.
I hadn't come across that Omnia router before - it looks great! Bit of a shame it doesn't support 802.11ax, and it is more expensive than I'd like, but still...
Might be a good idea to wait. It's coming soonish I think: - https://github.com/openwrt/luci/pull/4994 - https://forum.turris.cz/t/wifi-6-ax-adapter/10390/77 I think the router might be my favorite open hardware piece: - It was easier to setup then my old Asus router - Schematics and source are easy to access. - It has never not worked. - It is made by a company that is a domain registrar with a good track record on…
The Omnia was quite expensive, but I've gotten frequent updates for the last four years. It's a nice mix of hackable and "just works".
I've turned off the WiFi at this point, and just use it as a router now. The UniFi access point that I installed provides better coverage in my house since it's easier to place in a central location.
Overall, I'd rate it as a good value.
Re: An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology
#428Earlier quoted context omitted.
iCloud photos aren’t currently encrypted, but this system provides a clear path to doing that, while staving accusations that E2E of iCloud will allow people to host CP there with impunity. When the device uploads an image it’s also required to upload a cryptographic blob derived from the CSAM database which can then be used by iCloud to identify photos that might match. As built at the moment, your phone only “snitc…
>iCloud photos are encrypted, so scanning has to happen on device. Is this true? I feel like Apple benefits from the confusion about "Encrypted at rest" + "Encrypted in transit" and "E2E Encrypted". It's my understanding that Apple could scan the photos in iCloud, since they have the decryption keys, but they choose not to, as a compromise. I'm keying into this because this document: https://support.apple.com/en-us/H…
You’re right, currently iCloud photos isn’t E2E. I’ve updated my comment
Re: An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology
#429US Government: We suspect the person in this photo of committing a crime. Here is your subpoena, Apple. You are directed to scan all iPhone and iCloud storage for any pictures matching this NeuralHash and report to us where you find them. Chinese Government: Here is the NeuralHash for Tienanmen square. Delete all photos you find matching this or we will bar you from China. Apple has at this point already admitted thi…
As far as I can see: 1. This is a serious attempt to build a privacy preserving solution to child pornography. 2. The complaints are all slippery slope arguments that governments will force Apple to abuse the mechanism. These are clearly real concerns and even Tim Cook admits that if you build a back door, bad people will use it. However: Child pornography and the related abuse is widely thought of as a massive probl…
> So: where are the proposals for a better solution?
Better policing and child protective services to catch child abuse at the root, instead of panicking about the digital files it produces? If you'd been paying attention, you'd have noticed that real-world surveillance has massively increased, which should enable the police to catch predators more easily. Why count only privacy-betraying technology as a "solution", while ignoring the rise of police and surveillance capabilities?
Edit as reply because two downvotes means I am "posting too fast, please slow down" (thank you for respecting me enough to tell me when I can resume posting /s):
> How do you police people reaching out to children via messaging with sexual content?
First, this is one small element of child abuse - you want to prevent child rape, merely being exposed to sexual content is nowhere near severe enough to merit such serious privacy invasion. To prevent the actual abuse, one could use the near-omnipresent facial recognition cameras, license plate readers, messaging metadata, to find when a stranger is messaging or stalking a child, DNA evidence after the fact that is a deterrent to other offenders, phone location data, etc. etc. At first I thought I didn't have to spell this out.
Second, to answer your question: very easily. With parental controls, a decades old technology that is compatible with privacy and open-source. The parent can be the admin of the child's devices, and have access to their otherwise encrypted messages. There is no need to delegate surveillance (of everyone, not just children) to governments and corporations, when we have such a simple, obvious, already existing solution. It frankly boggles the mind how one could overlook it, especially compared to how technically complex Apple's approach is. Does the mention of child abuse simply cause one's thinking to shut down, and accept as gospel anything Apple or the government says, without applying the smallest bit of scrutiny?
Re: An Open Letter Against Apple's Privacy-Invasive Content Scanning Technology
#430More horrifying is the number of people defending or apologizing for this move. Truly mind boggling!
Anything for the children!! I think that earnest acceptance of “well, it’s for a good cause” style arguments indicates a severely stunted ability to generalize: either to generalize applications of the technology (it works on any proscribed content, not just stuff people generally agree is bad) or to generalize outcomes of this kind of corporate behavior (Apple will continue to actively spy on their customers as long…
yes, think about the children!
nobody thinks about the children that are literally starving every day or that are in social settings where they simply cannot succeed.
Let’s just treat everyone like disgusting criminals until THEY prove they are innocent by giving us access to everything they do.
The more I see, the more I want to literally dump all technology and go live off the grid.