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Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

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Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#421

Post by d3nj4l »

mnouquet wrote: post #116
pciexpgpu wrote: post #18

This is good. Now states are combating such hesitancy by drawing lottery for vaccinated folks. Like, having this magic, absolutely mind boggling potion that prevents serious illness and death *isn't* already the lottery win of our lifetime?? People in India and elsewhere are dying because of lack of vaccines and here we have educated, first world countries struggle to get their citizens vaccinated. Unfortunately sham…

> prevents serious illness and death Only in 60+ patients with co-morbidity.

Absolute insanity that people are still peddling this. Here in India I've seen people in their late 20s and 30s drop like flies from COVID.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#423

Post by mahogany »

jonhohle wrote: post #363
MikeKusold wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are not "obviously safe". The mRNA vaccines just had an article today that exposed a link to heart inflammation. The AstraZeneca vaccine also has some side effects that didn't show up in their abbreviated trials. I understand why someone would be hesitant to get a vaccine that only has Emergency Use Authorization. That said, I personally believe that the benefits outweigh the potential side-effects. If I weren't…

I'm concerned, especially in the tech community, that there is so much aggravation toward a group that wants more data before making a decision that could have long term repercussions. The CDC has a page describing past vaccine safety issues, the most recent being 2013[0]. Errors include unexpected side effects or complicates and manufacturing issues. The treatment being offered is unlike any other mainstream protoco…

> The CDC has a page describing past vaccine safety issues, the most recent being 2013[0].

That most recent one says there was a voluntary recall and no health problems were reported. Doesn't sound too concerning to me to be honest.

And because you mention long term effects a couple times -- how long would be long enough for you to feel okay about the safety of the vaccine, and how did you come up with this number?

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#424

Post by ghoward »

kaba0 wrote: post #417
ghoward wrote: post #404

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can science claim they are safe when we haven't even had the chance to do tests for long-term effects yet?

The vaccine’s matter is in your body for a day at most. The immune system is known for quite some time, and the immunization do happen. In what way could someone develop a side effect long after the vaccine? Of course medicine is data based, not necessarily about mechanisms, but at a point Occam’s razor has to apply. And either way, we would have seen by now any side effect since it has been injected into many millio…

Long-term effects are just that: long-term. We can't know what long-term effects the vaccines have until they have been used for a long time, even if millions have had them.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#425

Post by ghoward »

dlp211 wrote: post #420
ghoward wrote: post #402

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Has their advice for the past year been correct? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27460858

If masks and social distancing didn't work, you need to have some idea of why the Flu had its mildest year ever. Also, countless people have demonstrated with pulseox meters that blood oxygen saturation is unaffected by mask wearing, so while those findings are interesting, you are far too quick to draw any type of conclusions that masks don't work and/or are harmful.

And people are far too quick to think that masks do work and/or are not harmful.

What happened to the Precautionary Principle?

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#426

Post by threeseed »

swader999 wrote: post #318
threeseed wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The messaging on masks should have been that only n95 or better are worth the time Which is simply rubbish. Masks of all kinds will prevent transmission albeit with varying levels of efficacy. And most importantly they impact human behaviour in ways which prevent transmission. Not to mention that N95 masks are more expensive which would have reduced its use by people who are poorer and are far more likely to spread…

Ones of all design do help with droplet suppression. They do sweet f all for airborne unless properly fit and of the right rating. Covid for all practical purposes behaves like it is airborne. If you haven't realized this by now, I don't know what to say to convince you. Maybe these will help: https://wwwnc.cdc.gov/eid/article/26/5/19-0994_article https://www.acpjournals.org/doi/10.7326/M20-6817

I already said that not all masks are the same.

But any mask is better than no mask. Which is what happens if you mandate a far more expensive and harder to get N95 variant.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#427

Post by nsonha »

kaba0 wrote: post #405
nsonha wrote: post #234

I didn't even think of this before but now that i read this, i'm curious too. So basically Linus say mRNA vaccine does not change your genetic but then he proceed to say that it does exactly that to fight foreign proteins and it's ok because your cell's mRNA do that anyway. Do you see the difference? I guess there is a reason to raise concerns about the novelty of the technique, if this is indeed the first time artif…

> but then he proceed to say that it does exactly that to fight foreign proteins No he doesn’t say that and is not true. mRNAs are “commands”. They encode proteins — each triplet (of nucleotides) on it will translate to one protein building block. They are semi-stable and are actively destroyed in the cell so they can only produce a few protein molecules. So injecting mRNA will give a temporary command to the cells t…

This is what he said and he could be wrong but I'm not making up anything

> that the mRNA vaccines do is to add a dose their own specialized sequence that then makes your normal cell machinery generate that spike protein so that your body learns how to recognize it... your body now knows how to recognize and fight off a new foreign protein

So what happens if some faulty proteins are created from this process, any chance they then be used to build new cells and cause disorders?

I'm not on the "change genetic" argument anymore as I'm not sure what even defines that, just trying to understand the risks here.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#428

Post by mywittyname »

GuB-42 wrote: post #410
derekp7 wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that the a large chunk of the population aren't scientist so they don't understand the principles of the scientific method. And they aren't software developers, they don't have the mindset for it. And have you seen the way many people drive? There is a reason why the term "defensive driving" was coined.

I think a good understanding of the scientific method, skepticism and fact checking should be taught in school as early as possible. The only thing students get is material presented as the truth that they have to faithfully accept. They are almost never taught how to deal with unreliable material. It made sense in the pre-internet age where finding information was the hard part, but now, it is the opposite: too much…

> I think a good understanding of the scientific method, skepticism and fact checking should be taught in school as early as possible.

It is taught in schools, and taught young. The people who understand the scientific method have been doing it every year since the sixth grade. They did science fair projects, etc.

I just looked up modern educational standards, and kids are taught in grade six the scientific method and how to execute experiments using it.

The problem is, lots of people suck at school. They didn't care about it and their parents didn't care about it, so they didn't retain anything. There are an awful lot of adults in society that couldn't pass a fifth grade math test.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#429

Post by betwixthewires »

canadianfella wrote: post #157
walrus01 wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There are a LOT of anti-vaxxers who disingenuously couch their advocacy as "I'm only asking questions" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sealioning

I’ve been accused of this before and it’s fucking bullshit.

I get accused of something like this daily.

The internet is a fun place.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#430

Post by betwixthewires »

krastanov wrote: post #225
hashkb wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Were you saying something racist? I'm just asking.

Come on, really!? In a discussion about how trolls use "I am just asking", you decided that doing the same is a good idea. I am not op, but I have been accused of sealioning in the exact opposite direction: I was defending some curriculum based on ideas from critical race theory. Edit: Well, as the comment below alluded to, I probably missed a pretty obvious piece of sarcasm... This is certainly funny in hindsight.

They're not the exact opposite.
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