Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever • Hacker News Board

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#421

Post by sneak » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:05 PM UTC

woofcat wrote: post #237

gtirloni wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just bought it and moved on. I'm happy that she's happy. I couldn't care less.

Yeah, I'm not understanding a lot of the sentiment here. I suppose if you're a fresh grad, or not making a ton of money. However if an engagement ring's cost is some barrier to getting married... perhaps you're too young to get married? Life is expensive, and between cars, house, the actual wedding, kids, etc. The money I spent on my wives engagement ring seems like child's play. Also I feel like most women want it,…

> Life is expensive, and between cars, house, the actual wedding, kids, etc. The money I spent on my wives engagement ring seems like child's play.

I wonder if your literal children would feel like that if you'd taken the same money for a ring that will (presuming you proceed with marriage) pretty much never get worn, and invested it in an index fund until their 21st birthday.

"child's play" indeed is what I would call this level of financial misplanning.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#422

Post by akarma » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:09 PM UTC

jliptzin wrote: post #407

washadjeffmad wrote: post #406

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I went through this not that many years ago buying a ring for my SO. My biggest mistake was including her in the decision. She described what she wanted exactly– nothing gaudy or ostentatious, just a singular, tasteful stone on a plain band. Couldn't be simpler, could it? Finding stones that met her criteria was easy. Some were natural diamonds, some lab grown, many moissanite. From the outset, she said the meaning o…

I sincerely wish you good luck in your marriage, you’re going to need it.

Many women won't directly tell their partner "I want you to spend a couple months' salary on a beautiful diamond" because it's tasteless to request and it removes all the meaning behind the man doing so, but they'd also be disappointed if the man didn't do so unprompted. People and their emotions are complex like that.

I don't think there's any glaring issue with either party above, but it's like you expect all women in your life to be like many people on HN — hyper-rational, utilitarian devs who would never want a mined diamond because a cheaper artificial one with better clarity exists. It's not wrong, but it's not right - there is no right answer here. Traditional ideas of romance are a powerful force.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#423

Post by ask_b123 » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:09 PM UTC

WrtCdEvrydy wrote: post #332

falcor84 wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Most marriages collapse due to money. Some studies on factors leading to divorce do put 'money' (and particularly attitudes regarding money) as the biggest single factor, but I'm not familiar with any study (let alone a consensus) that it's a leading factor in 'most' divorces.

Money, Children and Infidelity. Children also includes weirdly a large subset on how to raise children (when marrying someone of a different faith)

Is this a book or a set of books or a study? Could you please tell me who is the author?

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#424

Post by pessimizer » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:10 PM UTC

KennethPT wrote: post #201

cyberpunk wrote: post #3

Married members of HN, what did you do if you think diamonds are utterly ridiclious however due to societal constraints some kind of ring is required for your SO?

Alternate view: Almost everything in life is ridiculous when you view it with cold logic. It's utterly ridiculous to put golden balls on a fake tree in your house every year, but due to societal constraints most people in Western societies do it. Your SO probably doesn't want a logical gift, she wants something sentimental that makes her feel that you care about her. For some people, that's an expensive rock with no…

I'm entirely against this sentiment, because logic isn't cold, it's a way to maximize your comfort and happiness. However, useless, expensive gifts are more effective than purposeful gifts from a mating perspective - wasting money is a sign of wealth, and that's cold logic.

The ring is basically a sacrifice, which goes with the "blood diamond" thing pretty neatly.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#425

Post by pessimizer » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:12 PM UTC

cecilpl2 wrote: post #376

tialaramex wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should where possible create rituals which do have a direct purpose anyway. Big example of real rituals which have purpose, Key Signing Ceremonies. Small example, when I leave somewhere I always pat both pockets twice, everything I absolutely need is always in those pockets, keys, wallet, phone. And so I won't leave them behind. The weird thing about the diamond engagement ring is that it isn't a powerful symbol…

> when I leave somewhere I always pat both pockets twice, everything I absolutely need is always in those pockets, keys, wallet, phone. After my wallet fell out of my pants pocket into my office chair and I thought I'd lost it for 2 days, I updated this ritual to do it every time I walk through a doorway. That way if I lose something I know exactly which room it's in.

> every time I walk through a doorway

Was just about to post this. I didn't start doing this on purpose, but at some point I noticed I was.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#426

Post by savanaly » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:12 PM UTC

988747 wrote: post #323

gruez wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>the high cost and useless-ness of the gift are a feature not a bug! The burning of significant amount of wealth is a costly signal of commitment to the receiver. So basically... proof of work?

More like "sunk cost fallacy".

No, they're really different. Just because the sunk cost fallacy has something to do with spending money doesn't mean it applies whenever money is spent in an unwise way.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signalling_(economics)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunk_cost

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#427

Post by slovette » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:13 PM UTC

intergalplan wrote: post #417

washadjeffmad wrote: post #406

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I went through this not that many years ago buying a ring for my SO. My biggest mistake was including her in the decision. She described what she wanted exactly– nothing gaudy or ostentatious, just a singular, tasteful stone on a plain band. Couldn't be simpler, could it? Finding stones that met her criteria was easy. Some were natural diamonds, some lab grown, many moissanite. From the outset, she said the meaning o…

Now try a "used" diamond. shudders

Haha. Could you imagine the horror of a USED DIAMOND!

It reminds me of the scene in Lord of War about the atrocity of a “used gun”.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#428

Post by amalcon » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:15 PM UTC

washadjeffmad wrote: post #406

joeblau wrote: post #65

Random diamond story! As a freshman in college, I took a geology class and our teacher asked all of the women in our class to raise their hand if they would rather have natural or human-made diamonds. Most of the women (over 80%) raised their hands for natural. The reasons they gave all seemed to tie back to branding and natural diamonds being “real.” Then our teacher gave another analogy. He asked if people would ra…

I went through this not that many years ago buying a ring for my SO. My biggest mistake was including her in the decision. She described what she wanted exactly– nothing gaudy or ostentatious, just a singular, tasteful stone on a plain band. Couldn't be simpler, could it? Finding stones that met her criteria was easy. Some were natural diamonds, some lab grown, many moissanite. From the outset, she said the meaning o…

I brought my now-spouse along for ring shopping, on her own theory that she'd be wearing the thing and should therefore have some input. She was actually more opposed to mined diamonds than I was at the time. We talked about this extensively, and considered both lab gems and corundum gems (ruby/sapphire).

We went through over a dozen jewelry stores, each of them pushing mined diamonds so hard that it angered us. The eventual solution wasn't even that we found an amenable jewelry store. We ended up obtaining a ring via a private transfer from a family member. While the ring contains a mined diamond, it has quite a bit of sentimental value and didn't really put price pressure on the public market. It was a good solution for us, but obviously not scalable!

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#429

Post by saberdancer » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:16 PM UTC

akarma wrote: post #422

jliptzin wrote: post #407

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I sincerely wish you good luck in your marriage, you’re going to need it.

Many women won't directly tell their partner "I want you to spend a couple months' salary on a beautiful diamond" because it's tasteless to request and it removes all the meaning behind the man doing so, but they'd also be disappointed if the man didn't do so unprompted. People and their emotions are complex like that. I don't think there's any glaring issue with either party above, but it's like you expect all women…

It's like typical "I don't need anything for my birthday". Even the most rational people tend to get disappointed if they really get nothing.

Re: Pandora says laboratory-made diamonds are forever

#430

Post by the_local_host » Tue, May 04, 2021, 3:16 PM UTC

joeblau wrote: post #65

Random diamond story! As a freshman in college, I took a geology class and our teacher asked all of the women in our class to raise their hand if they would rather have natural or human-made diamonds. Most of the women (over 80%) raised their hands for natural. The reasons they gave all seemed to tie back to branding and natural diamonds being “real.” Then our teacher gave another analogy. He asked if people would ra…

Equivalent is not as good when what matters is what other people think.

Even if the person displaying a luxury artifact agrees that some other artifact is equivalent, if the people they're displaying it to don't also agree, then there is a difference that's relevant to the purpose of the artifact, which is to advertise your wealth.

Though the topic at hand is diamonds, which are strongly associated with wedding proposals, this principle applies equally to sports cars, guitars, etc.