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Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

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Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#421
post #382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They both have loud fans, along with every other pc laptop in that league it seems. MacBooks are virtually quiet most of the time.

A bit too quiet sometimes, to the point of melting my lap. There's even an app to set the fan speed and prevent overheating.

Yeah, quiet but goes to 100C constantly. Once I get the razer I'll check what's the temps/loudness there. But with the MBP, I turn the fans up all the time, to avoid burning my fingers when I type :/

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#422

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And why do you think that a lot of people who are painfully aware of all the issues you mention still refuse to use Linux on a laptop while happily using it on servers? There is a riduculous repetitiveness about this debate. For me and many others, Linux on a laptop has always been unstable, insecure, hot and noisy. Many specific issues can be fixed if you put in the effort, but on almost every dist-upgrade something…

> For me and many others, Linux on a laptop has always been unstable, insecure, hot and noisy. I've successfully converted many people with similar claims over to Linux and here's what I've found; most of them were trying Linux on a subpar, non-standard laptop, (Like an old MacBook or a slow Celeron), to lower their investment if they don't like it, which is fine, but then comparing the experience to their high end M…

FWIW, my Macbook (not my primary machine) cost me 400€ second hand and I spent another 100€ upgrading to 8GB Ram and an SSD drive. It's a ten year old machine which runs like a dream.

I challenge anyone to find a better computing solution for 500€.

You could install Linux on a 500€ laptop but you wouldn't have the keyboard or screen quality of the Macbook, nor would have access to the Apple ecosystem. A lot of programs for Mac are just really well made and nice to use.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#423
post #376

I honestly don't understand all these quality sacrifices just to make things thinner. It makes the product actually feel somewhat cheap and brittle. The same thing confuses me with smartphones. Everyone keeps making these bacteria and finger print magnets thinner... the minute you drop it, it's shattered or unuseable... and so then you're buying a case to protect it from scratches and shatter... so what's the point o…

Especially in cases when it doesn't need to be thinner. I just tried out a Apple Magic Keyboard, which is a razor blade for some reason, and had wrist pain within a few hours of using it. Everybody's different, but this keyboard is trash. It is designed solely to look pretty in marketing photos. I'm not a keyboard snob. I don't need Cherry MX Blue's to be happy. I thought the Apple Wireless Keyboard (with the AA batt…

I have borrowed one from a colleague, because I like to swap keyboards every now and then for variation and the old Apple Wireless Keyboards were ok. I also had wrist pain within hours with the Magic Keyboard. This is a huge difference compared to the unassuming Microsoft Sculp Ergonomic Keyboard, which is not only cheaper but really feels nice in comparison. It also has genuinely useful features such as reverse tilt, a magnetic battery door, a split, and wide spacebars. Plus it has full-size arrow keys (though I don't use them much, because vim/evil).

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#424

I honestly don't understand all these quality sacrifices just to make things thinner. It makes the product actually feel somewhat cheap and brittle. The same thing confuses me with smartphones. Everyone keeps making these bacteria and finger print magnets thinner... the minute you drop it, it's shattered or unuseable... and so then you're buying a case to protect it from scratches and shatter... so what's the point o…

> and so then you're buying a case to protect it from scratches and shatter... so what's the point of making it thinner in the first place? I agree, also in terms of material. I'd love to buy a plastic phone with some bezel that doesn't shatter easily. The Nokia Lumias a couple years back (e.g. the Lumia 800[0]) were good-looking and super robust. But manufacturers obviously don't have much incentive to make hardware…

> The Nokia Lumias a couple years back (e.g. the Lumia 800[0]) were good-looking and super robust.

Yes, I have a Lumia 640 here and I really like it from a hardware point of view. It's a shame that it only runs Windows Mobile, I wish so much that I was able to just install Android on it.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#426
post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Especially in cases when it doesn't need to be thinner. I just tried out a Apple Magic Keyboard, which is a razor blade for some reason, and had wrist pain within a few hours of using it. Everybody's different, but this keyboard is trash. It is designed solely to look pretty in marketing photos. I'm not a keyboard snob. I don't need Cherry MX Blue's to be happy. I thought the Apple Wireless Keyboard (with the AA batt…

I am currently using this horrible keyboard. Hate this thing. Before I've been using a mechanical keyboard, but coworkers complained that it was too loud. I like loud keybords. The sound is so pleasant and satisfying I want it to be even more intense. I want to feel vibration every time I hit the key. And when I hit enter I want there to be a minor earthquake. This apple trash keyboard doesn't have Shift+Insert. The…

The Microsoft Sculpt Ergonomic Keyboard does not have loud switches, but feels much better than the Magic Keyboard. Only the function keys are not great.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#427

"engineers its own downfall" Hyperbole much? TLDR the new MacBook Pro keyboard doesn't repair as well as the old keyboard: -- In our eyes, the new design was a repairability flop. We downgraded Apple from a seven-out-of-ten to a two. -- We're calling this a downfall now? I feel like we just got trolled.

Did you read the rest of the article? It's very well explained, and makes some really good points. Of course they're biased towards one factor above all else: repairability. It's right there in the name of the company! But calling this a troll post isn't justified.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#428
post #386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We can’t know that. There would have to be two otherwise identical devices, one thick; more robust; larger battery.

I'm pretty sure marketers and designers really do know that. How light a device feels in the hand is pretty much the very first thing someone notices when picking up a new device, and sets the stage for the rest of their expectations. We also know that in most cases (of course not every case) first impressions are a much bigger influence on the final decision to purchase than later analysis and consideration, regardl…

> We also know that [...] first impressions are a much bigger influence on the final decision to purchase than later analysis and consideration

But this is the whole point of the GP's criticism: The whole design of the device is driven by optimizing purchase, not actually by making it usable, useful or durable.

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#429
post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Short of fitting a keyboard condom, or iPad (no doubt called TouchBoard) where the keyboard used to be, what can they do? Make the battery thinner so they can get sane key travel back within the case without increasing overall thickness? So I expect to see a couple more releases of ultra thin keyboards with various fix mechanisms before they accept that rules of physics and dust apply to them too. :)

> what can they do? Make the case thicker.

they are already invested in the current chassis, and it's not changing for at least two next generations

Re: Apple Engineers Its Own Downfall with the Macbook Pro Keyboard

#430

I honestly don't understand all these quality sacrifices just to make things thinner. It makes the product actually feel somewhat cheap and brittle. The same thing confuses me with smartphones. Everyone keeps making these bacteria and finger print magnets thinner... the minute you drop it, it's shattered or unuseable... and so then you're buying a case to protect it from scratches and shatter... so what's the point o…

> the minute you drop it, it's shattered or unuseable

For Apple, that might be a feature ...

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