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Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

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Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#411

Post by tartoran »

vessenes wrote: post #317
tartoran wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is cooling though?

Yeah I wonder the same thing - I keep getting told heat management in space is hard, but nobody discusses this inre the data centers. My understanding is one cooling mechanism is to just shoot lasers out into space (is this sci fi?) - I guess in that case you could just send energy back to your solar rigs, depending on wavelengths. TLDR: no idea

The whole thing is pie in the sky same as landing people on Mars. It's cool but if you look into deeper it doesn't make much sense and it's extremely challenging and on top of it all expensive as hell.

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#412

Post by rchaud »

Rover222 wrote: post #392
laidoffamazon wrote: post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone trying to monitor the situation using Twitter the last few weeks it’s awful and it used to not be!

It’s flawed, but still the obvious place to monitor a situation.

It's long been taken over by Telegram, which among its other advantages (more like a message board than 'town square'), doesn't have hordes of people commenting "@grok explain this to me" under every post.

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#413

Post by glitchc »

yoyohello13 wrote: post #352
Imnimo wrote: post #125

I think the problem for xAI is that it can really only hire two types of researchers - people who are philosophically aligned with Elon, and people who are solely money-motivated (not a judgment). But frontier AI research is a field with a lot of top talent who have strong philosophical motivation for their work, and those philosophies are often completely at odds with Elon. OpenAI and Anthropic have philosophical ni…

> people who are solely money-motivated (not a judgment). Honestly, we should judge. There should be judgment for people who are solely money motivated and making the world a worse place. I know, blah blah privilege, something something mouths to feed. Platitudes to help the rich assholes sleep at night. If you are wealthy and making stuff that hurts people, you are a piece of shit and should be called out, simple.

Work is and has always been an economic bargain: Your time for their money. Morality is a luxury that only the independently wealthy can afford. Any business that allows it's employees to function according to their own morals becomes uncompetitive against its peers. That's why small companies by individual founders who want to stay true to their mission often stay small. They inevitably get bought out by one of the larger ones.

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#414

Post by kennywinker »

tmp10423288442 wrote: post #342
kennywinker wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the issue is simply this: wikipedia trends towards unbiased info through use of the crowd. Grok, with a single owner with an ax to grind, trends towards whatever elon wants. It’s poisoned information under the control of one man - cyberpunk novels have been written about less.

> wikipedia trends towards unbiased info through use of the crowd See, this is why people even give a project like Grokipedia the time of day. While in theory anyone can edit Wikipedia, in practice the moderators form a much smaller and weirder cabal, and they reject edits that go against their views. The frustration with the naive assertion that Wikipedia distills the wisdom of the crowds with the reality of Wikiped…

> and they reject edits that go against their views

Citation needed. See what i did there ;)

They reject edits that go against their views on tone and sourcing not political views that i am aware of - i am sure it happens from time to time but unless there’s a consistant bias in one direction this isn’t a valid criticism of the political neutrality of wikipedia.

Even if there is rampant bias in wikipedia, that’s a reason to fork it and change the structure and gatekeeping - not to replace it with a techno-authoritarian ai version controlled by a single billionaire. That’s amplifying the problem from an aggregate bias of 600,000 users who have made an edit in the last 30 days[1] to just one editor who uses ai to make it seem impartial.

[1] https://expandedramblings.com/index.php/wikipedia-statistics...

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#415

Post by SideQuark »

kvetching wrote: post #354
Braxton1980 wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>He wants it to be truthful How do you know this? Why would you believe him considering the massive lies he's told, for example about the 2020 widespread election fraud

https://artificialanalysis.ai/evaluations/omniscience?omnisc... AA-Omniscience Hallucination Rate (lower is better) measures how often the model answers incorrectly when it should have refused or admitted to not knowing the answer. It is defined as the proportion of incorrect answers out of all non-correct responses, i.e. incorrect / (incorrect + partial answers + not attempted). Grok 4.2 which was just released in t…

Of all the valuable metrics on that site, all of which grok does badly at except one, you managed to pick that single one.

https://artificialanalysis.ai/models

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#416

Post by Retr0id »

wolvoleo wrote: post #362
Retr0id wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are 8 billion humans, any fictional human is going to look almost exactly like at least one real human.

Yes but for bullying purposes this is not useful. You're not going to try generating a pic 8 billion times till you get it right.

I'm sure the odds go up a lot once you describe the characteristics you want

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#417

Post by [deleted] »

munificent wrote: post #377
bdangubic wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if you want to make the world a better place as OP stated perhaps you can get a normal job in maybe less evil corp?

When presented with a choice between: 1. Take a job making $$$$$$$ at a company making the world worse. 2. Take a job making $$$ at a company not making the world worse. Very few people have a personality such that they'll pick 2.

[deleted]

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#418

Post by yoyohello13 »

0x3f wrote: post #382
yoyohello13 wrote: post #370

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think ad tech is probably the single most destructive technology of the new millennium. The shift toward "engagement at all costs" business strategies is basically the root cause of societies current political polarization. Engagement bait cultivates fear and rage in the populace to get clicks. We are now seeing the consequences of shoving ads that sow fear, anger, doubt and inadequacy into peoples faces 24/7. This…

Well I'm not sure I entirely believe this myself, but it seems easy enough to argue that this is progress of a sort. The West assumes pure democracy as the final form of government that we are all convergently evolving towards. But if this form of government or society is not robust to the kinds of things you're talking about, should it not suffer the consequences and be adapted or flushed for our long-term bettermen…

That’s fair enough. I wouldn’t say I’m happy about needing to live through interesting times, but if we make it out the other end maybe something better will come of it.

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#419

Post by lo_zamoyski »

0x3f wrote: post #337
lo_zamoyski wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Moral knowledge doesn't really exist. If that is the case, then why should you or anyone prefer to believe your claim that moral knowledge doesn’t exist over the contrary?

Different kinds of claims, it's not self-referential

> Different kinds of claims

How so?

If I claim that one should prefer the claim "moral knowledge doesn't exist" over its contrary, then I am making a moral claim. That would make it self-refuting.

There is no fact-value dichotomy.

And one more thing...

> the lack of falsifiability

Is falsifiability falsifiable? If all credible claims must be falsifiable, then where does that leave us with the criterion of falsifiability (which is problematic even part from this particular case, as anyone who has done any serious reading in the philosophy of science knows).

Re: Elon Musk pushes out more xAI founders as AI coding effort falters

#420

Post by hunterpayne »

scubbo wrote: post #402
ecshafer wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Great point! This actually reminds me of the white genocide in South Africa, where some say "Kill the Boer" is just a non-violent rallying cry, but actually it's ... Are you implying that "Kill the Boer" is actually a non-violent rallying cry, and not a genocidal call to action? Ill say that that is an absurd notion, and if you s/Boer/Jew or whatever ethnic or religious group you want, it will become very obvious w…

> Are you implying that "Kill the Boer" is actually a non-violent rallying cry (Not the person you're replying to, so caveats about me speaking for them, but) no, they're not. They're highlighting how Grok _isn't_ accurate/unbiased/whatever, by giving examples of how it distorts the truth to fit Elon's narrative.

I assure you that all the models have such biases. Ask any LLM who caused the most death in history and you will get skinny mustache man, an opinion any historian will tell you is wrong. He is in the top 5, but not the top of the table. That was clearly biased into the models in the same way Elon biases his models. I'm not defending this behavior but I don't know how you both get models that returned the sanitized answers some want and the correct answers others want at the same time. Pure correctness probably gets you Mecha-H. Pure sanitized answers will get many wrong. Pick your poison I guess.
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