Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy • Hacker News Board

Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy

#411

Post by glenstein » Tue, Sep 23, 2025, 2:18 AM UTC

drakythe wrote: post #228

WhyNotHugo wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Google doesn't have control of Chromium though. They do. If they merge DRM into it tomorrow or something alike, it trickles down to all users of Chromium and Google Chrome. You can build _a fork_ of it. But the enormous majority of the masses don’t use your fork — they use upstream.

Chromium is upstream of Chrome, not the other way around. However, Google Chrome is so ubiquitous that any changes Google makes to it are expected to be available in all other browsers and its a kind of defacto control even if it isn't technically control of the upstream Chromium project.

I didn't take them to be suggesting that, and I don't think it makes any difference to the point they're making. Google controls commits to Chromium which then make it into Chrome.

They do have technical control over the upstrean Chromium project. There's an invite only pool of developers who decide what gets committed to Chromium and they are Google employees.

Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy

#412

Post by throwaway106382 » Tue, Sep 23, 2025, 2:19 AM UTC

xenelor wrote: post #275

The hype around Omarchy is just insane.. It is not an installer script (anymore), so instead you have to download a 7GB ISO file (in the name of 'good UX') that ships with Zoom, Spotify, Hey, Basecamp, Steam, Minecraft (??), etc. but you still end up using the same package mirrors (arch's). If it was an install script, like LARBS or many others (before and after omarchy), I'd (almost) get it. If it was a derivative d…

The hype around Rails is just insane.

It's not just a few libs (anymore), so instead you have to download hundreds of gems (in the game of 'good dev ex') that ships with activsupport, and ORM, ERB and even pushes an app architecture on you but you still end up using ruby. If it was just a few things like sinatra and sequel I'd (almost) get it. If it was a fork of another project like Merb I'd (almost get it) but this just make no sense. I'm all for making web development more accessible but this aint it, chief.

Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy

#413

Post by dpflug » Tue, Sep 23, 2025, 2:23 AM UTC

robinhood wrote: post #101

xandrius wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no way you didn't write this comment while laughing out loud. For-profit companies care about profits for their shareholders, that's it. Heck, even non-profit often tend to value more profit than their integrity or cause but that's a topic for another day. I wish this wasn't the case but even good-willed individuals at the helm of for-profits are forced to pursue profit and avoid anything clearly leading to…

I'm sorry you see the world that way.

Cloudflare is domiciled in the USA, where shareholder supremacy has been part of US corporate law going all the way back to Dodge v Ford Motor Co. in 1919.

Now, it's in Cali, where it's not as strong a statement as in some other states, but it's still got a lot of precedent behind it.

Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy

#414

Post by wiredpancake » Tue, Sep 23, 2025, 2:27 AM UTC

sgloutnikov wrote: post #359

xenelor wrote: post #275

The hype around Omarchy is just insane.. It is not an installer script (anymore), so instead you have to download a 7GB ISO file (in the name of 'good UX') that ships with Zoom, Spotify, Hey, Basecamp, Steam, Minecraft (??), etc. but you still end up using the same package mirrors (arch's). If it was an install script, like LARBS or many others (before and after omarchy), I'd (almost) get it. If it was a derivative d…

The install script is still there, you don't have to use the ISO [0]. I prefer to do my own btrfs subvolumes, partitioning, tweaks, etc and just run the script after a base install. Uninstalling anything is a matter of seconds from the provided menus. [0] https://learn.omacom.io/2/the-omarchy-manual/96/manual-insta...

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Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy

#415

Post by userbinator » Tue, Sep 23, 2025, 2:46 AM UTC

yawaramin wrote: post #396

pmdr wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't understand why we always assume bad faith. I'm already bombarded with cloudflare captchas when using Firefox, especially on Linux. Residential IP address. I'm suspicious of everything cloudflare is doing right now.

You're bombarded with Cloudflare captchas because bots are heavily scraping the websites you're browsing and they are struggling to stay online by putting in place heavy-handed bot-fighting tactics. Without Cloudflare, you wouldn't have the website you're browsing.

Or CF could just do better caching, which was their original reason for existence.

Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy

#416

Post by blinkingled » Tue, Sep 23, 2025, 2:57 AM UTC

I am happy for a new browser/engine but I'm highly skeptical that Ladybird will ever come close to Chrome or Firefox in terms of features, compatibility and performance. It's just very hard to imagine. There's servo and look at where it is after 13 years!

No offense to anyone really but browser engines are inhumane amount of talent and effort. Might as well just keep making Firefox better.

Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy

#417

Post by jm4 » Tue, Sep 23, 2025, 3:02 AM UTC

blinkingled wrote: post #416

I am happy for a new browser/engine but I'm highly skeptical that Ladybird will ever come close to Chrome or Firefox in terms of features, compatibility and performance. It's just very hard to imagine. There's servo and look at where it is after 13 years! No offense to anyone really but browser engines are inhumane amount of talent and effort. Might as well just keep making Firefox better.

The problem with Firefox is Mozilla. That’s also a common thread with Servo. Maybe Servo will get better now that it doesn’t have that baggage anymore. If we’re going to have a chromium alternative, it won’t be anything from Mozilla.

Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy

#418

Post by 1oooqooq » Tue, Sep 23, 2025, 3:06 AM UTC

marginalia_nu wrote: post #361

1oooqooq wrote: post #333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

absolutely not. every single arch user thought of making a distro with opinionated defaults, but then they realize the just have to edit the wiki to provide the community the same benefit. some rich dude lack the self awareness for such. he's both ignoring advanced users would rather have option open and defaults documented, and new users would just use manjaro.

I like Omarchy as an advanced user. I migrated off vanilla Arch + Hypr to Omarchy because it saves me a bunch of hassle setting all that up myself. I want the outcome, don't particularly enjoy the fiddling. I definitely could, I've even done LFS way back in the day, but I have other things I'd rather do with my time these days. I think it's in many ways a project that caters to professional programmers. It's definite…

comparing arch with LFS is wild, but thanks for sharing.

I personally just pacman install the kde metapackage, and I'm done.

Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy

#419

Post by zem » Tue, Sep 23, 2025, 3:11 AM UTC

pseudosavant wrote: post #307

fabrice_d wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you think they moved to Chromium then? They switched because they could not support a competitive engine by themselves.

Because no amount of money was going to solve the problem of people saying they think Microsoft's browser is slower/worse/etc. Switching to Chromium negated that in a way nothing else could. When Microsoft beat Netscape with IE, it was by building a far better browser. Google is a stronger competitor than Netscape ever was though. Without Google dropping the ball (like Netscape), Microsoft would never exceed Chrome's…

I feel like they burnt enough browser goodwill with IE that no one who was on the internet back then wants to touch a microsoft browser regardless of the engine

Re: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy

#420

Post by zem » Tue, Sep 23, 2025, 3:13 AM UTC

zaphar wrote: post #405

account42 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That response ignores the fact that Valve isn't in the business of preventing you from playing your games on niche operating systems but Cloudflare is in the business of blocking non-standard browsers. If Cloudflare truly wants to prevent a Google/Apple web duopoly the most effective thing they can do is to stop blocking alternatives or even just browser- configurations that are Google-hostile.

I have never seen credible evidence that this is what Cloudflare sees as their business. They fundamentally don't care what browser the user is using. What they care about are the traffic patterns of users and preventing their customers from getting hit by bots, spam, and other malicious traffic. The fact that some browsers that look like malicious traffic is not something they can control or reasonably be held respo…

surely they can be held responsible - they are the ones defining whatever heuristics cause traffic to be classed as malicious!