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Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy
411–420 of 456 posts
Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy
#412[flagged]
Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy
#413Earlier quoted context omitted.
Your first point is correct, but it (like the second one) has no bearing on the issue of the medical soundness of the department's positions and policy.
But the bbc's reputation does support the facts in the article. I am confident that the stock did drop because of what he said, because i trust the BBC not to make up such things.
I feel the same way, but again, this has no bearing on the issue of the medical soundness of the department's positions and policy.
Going back to the top of this thread, I agree that correlation does not mean causation, but in this case, we do not yet even have a justifiable claim of correlation, and RFK Jr. has repeatedly demonstrated his propensity for substituting unfounded opinion and incorrect data for empirical facts, if it suits his agenda.
Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy
#414I'm always surprised at the hostility to Acetaminophen on HN (or Paracetamol as we call it here in the UK). It's one of the most commonly used medicines in the UK - and certainly the most popular painkiller. YouGov even did a survey confirming that - https://ygo-assets-websites-editorial-emea.yougov.net/docume... The safety aspects of it are not something that gets raised in the UK much - other than suicide attempts,…
A friend of mine, Eric Engstrom, died of liver failure after taking (too much) Tylenol. Tylenol use over time can sneak up on you in the form of cumulative liver damage. No, I'm not a doctor and this isn't medical advice. Personally, a works-most-of-the-time treatment for headaches is going out for a walk. I don't know why it works, but it does.
Yep, my mom worked in the pediatric ER, she never let Tylenol/acetaminophen in the house, my understanding is that she saw way too many cases of liver damage and death.
Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy
#415It is the safest painkiller currently available. Ibuprofen can cause gut bleeding and renal issues if overdosed on. We all know about opiates. Some facts - typical adult dose is 1g. Max suggested cap on the drug label is 3g per day (about 6 pills at usual 500mg dose). You need to take 10g (20 pills) to be at real risk of hepatotoxicity. So 10 times the typical dose is when you have overdose effects. (basically 20 pil…
There is a “better” painkiller than both Tylenol and Ibuprofen (Metamizol), but it has been forbidden on the US based on a study attributing strong side-effects to it, despite it being freely available over the counter on multiple countries for decades without issue. If this study is true, it should be easy to compare prevalence of autism on these countries that don’t rely on Tylenol.
It's not just banned in the US; it's also banned in France, the UK, Norway, Sweden, Iran, and Canada among others. It is legal OTC in India, the former USSR, China, Mexico, and most of South and Central America. It is the most popular prescribed pain reliever in Germany and the most popular OTC drug in Brazil. It is popular in Spain as well.
Metamizole is actually a very interesting case, to me, as the associated risk is quite strange. It is legal and popular OTC for the majority of the world population; in the countries where it is legal, there are few deaths from the native population. Among tourists who consume it, however, mortality is unusually high. The Spanish health ministry declared in 2018 that it should not be used in the "floating population", including tourists. There may be a genetic component involving Anglo-Saxons. See: https://www.theguardian.com/science/2023/nov/26/painkiller-b...
Here's a map of its availability: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Metamizole_(Dipyrone...
_Availability_World_Map.svg){kind=link}
Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy
#416There is research correlating autism and mothers taking certain medications (painkillers, antidepressants). Since autism is hereditary, there is a significant chance that these mothers are autistic too. Autistic people have a vastly high risk of depression, and often have unusual pain thresholds, requiring more painkillers. I would not be surprised of the correlation was real, but the direction of action was reversed…
> Since autism is hereditary, there is a significant chance that these mothers are autistic too. Yep. Two of my 5 are clearly HFA (1 diagnosed) and another shows strong indications. My wife and I have numerous family members that are somewhere on the spectrum. It's how this works.
How can one know it is due to DNA or how the brain works versus learned behaviour? I suppose it is possible to learn different traits and behaviour from parents so that the offspring behave in an autistic way even if they are not "physically" autistic.
Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy
#417There really are risks. It's just not worth it during pregnancy. The pain killing effects of tylenol aren't worth the potential risks during pregnancy. https://www.mountsinai.org/about/newsroom/2025/mount-sinai-s...
Yep, my wife didn’t take Tylenol during pregnancy due to actual studied risks to the child. If she had a headache she just bore the pain. RFK is a loony and I don’t know about the link to autism but Tylenol should not be taken by the mother during pregnancy.
Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy
#418I'm always surprised at the hostility to Acetaminophen on HN (or Paracetamol as we call it here in the UK). It's one of the most commonly used medicines in the UK - and certainly the most popular painkiller. YouGov even did a survey confirming that - https://ygo-assets-websites-editorial-emea.yougov.net/docume... The safety aspects of it are not something that gets raised in the UK much - other than suicide attempts,…
If Paracetamol was invented today it would likely never receive an OTC (over the counter sale, meaning you can just buy it from a retail outlet the way you'd buy cough medicine or toothpaste) license in the UK. Yes, it's safe (and for a bunch of people including me, effective) at the licensed dose, but it's useless at about half that dose, and it's toxic, leading to very nasty deaths in some cases, at just about 3-4…
personal responsibility is more common in the UK, it is assumed that one can cross the road safely without needing traffic lights for example, or walk along a stretch of an ancient monument without needing a handrail.
I've never met anyone here who has ever had any issues associated with paracetamol abuse/overdose, and only a single person who failed to cross the road correctly.
Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy
#419Earlier quoted context omitted.
> We all know about opiates No, I do not think we do, because it causes none of the side-effects associated with NSAIDs, and it is even safer than acetaminophen, i.e. there is no risk of hepatotoxicity whatsoever. The only side-effect is euphoria. Please do not mention respiratory depression here, that is a non-issue, it matters as so much as liver failure matters with acetaminophen overdoses. Opiates are safer than…
If the safest drug is also the one most prone to misuse, and misuse makes it unsafe, then it is no longer the safest drug. The reason society should be wary is precisely because people misuse it on a scale that vastly eclipses garden variety drugs like acetaminophen.
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Re: Kenvue stock drops on report RFK Jr will link autism to Tylenol during pregnancy
#420Earlier quoted context omitted.
You misunderstood me, then. Therapeutic doses of opiates do not cause respiratory depression, overdoses do, similarly to how acetaminophen overdoses cause hepatotoxicity, except this is not true, because regular consumption of acetaminophen causes hepatotoxicity, too, whereas opiates, when taken as prescribed, do not cause respiratory depression, in case of opiates, ONLY overdoses do, and therein lies the huge differ…
I think you're missing the point, though. Patients are much more likely to abuse/misuse an opiate, leading to much more than the "therapeutic" dose being taken. But most people aren't going to overdose on ibuprofen or acetaminophen. If they do, it's because they've made a foolish decision ("the pain didn't go away with one pill, so if I take five maybe it will"). When it comes to opiates, taking too much will general…
> taking too much will generally be because of a chemical dependence, not a conscious choice.
This is an oversimplification and not universally true, but I do not wish to get into the details of it and addiction in general. We could brush away every decisions based on "chemical imbalances", too, if we so want. :)
> we should prefer opiates over ibuprofen/acetaminophen when the latter will do the job
Yes, after a careful risk assessment. If you are likely to get ulcers, or a stroke, or any cardiovascular events from NSAIDs, then you might want to consider something safer. Tylenol would be safer in this case, but what if that does not help with the pain at all? In any case, I do not necessarily disagree, and I was not advocating for blind consumption of opioids. If Tylenol works, take it with milk thistle (with high silybilin content) and you will be fine, even if you take it on the daily.