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Marines being mobilized in response to LA protests

cnn.com

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Re: Marines being mobilized in response to LA protests

#411

Post by closewith »

yokoprime wrote: post #393
jxjnskkzxxhx wrote: post #223

There's a reason you separate military and the police. One fights the enemies of the state. The other serves and protects the people. When the military becomes both, then the enemies of the state tend to become the people.

And their training reflects this. I've served in the army, but not in the US. Some units did get crowd control training, but it was very unusual and specific for their deployments (they were going to Kosovo). Preparing these units for crowd control required weeks of training. Crowd control is pretty much the opposite of modern warfare, with large number of troops marching shoulder to shoulder forming shield walls, ev…

> I've served in the army, but not in the US.

Probably very specific, but I was in two non-US militaries and all combat corps were trained in Aid to the Civil Power, including public order, and were regularly refreshed.

Re: Marines being mobilized in response to LA protests

#412

Post by thaumasiotes »

fenomas wrote: post #342
jxjnskkzxxhx wrote: post #223

There's a reason you separate military and the police. One fights the enemies of the state. The other serves and protects the people. When the military becomes both, then the enemies of the state tend to become the people.

Recent anecdote from Popehat, about the 1992 riots in Los Angeles: > /4 So “cover me” to the LAPD means “if someone pops up with a gun and shoots at me, shoot at them.” Apparently to the Marines it means “lay down a curtain of suppressive fire using your rifles.” Hilarity ensued. https://bsky.app/profile/kenwhite.bsky.social/post/3lr2w7wo3...

> Apparently to the Marines it means “lay down a curtain of suppressive fire using your rifles.”

Is that supposed to be a surprise to someone? What do you think "cover fire" is?

Re: Marines being mobilized in response to LA protests

#413

Post by addandsubtract »

daft_pink wrote: post #114

I lived through the BLM protests in a liberal city. They let them destroy everything, then they called in the National Guard to stop looting that already happened. Everyone’s okay with peaceful protests, but they should call in the national guard and prosecute people for violence. You might hate Trump, but in my previous experience, it’s the residents of the most liberal districts that suffer all the consequences of…

You're making it sound like the "violence" started in a vacuum. Let's not forget where the actual violence and unlawfulness originated from – in both the BLM and ICE protests.

Re: Marines being mobilized in response to LA protests

#414

Post by davidguetta »

CobrastanJorji wrote: post #358

Because the CNN article seems to have accidentally omitted it, allow me to paste the full text of 18 U.S. Code § 1385, the Posse Comitatus Act: > Whoever, except in cases and under circumstances expressly authorized by the Constitution or Act of Congress, willfully uses any part of the Army, the Navy, the Marine Corps, the Air Force, or the Space Force as a posse comitatus or otherwise to execute the laws shall be fi…

> except in cases and under circumstances expressly authorized by the Constitution or Act of Congress

They are arguing there's an insurrenction in California.

Re: Marines being mobilized in response to LA protests

#416

Post by dontlaugh »

kpw94 wrote: post #302
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> One fights the enemies of the state "At stake is a fundamental component of the framework of US constitutional democracy. It begins with the principle, enshrined in law, that military forces exist to protect the country from existential threats — such as an invasion or rebellion — not to enforce the law. Most fundamentally, the founders of the American republic understood very clearly that concentrated military pow…

> military forces exist to protect the country from existential threats — such as an invasion or rebellion — not to enforce the law. serious question: are Countries such as Italy, France etc not a democracy? All of them are, verbatim from wikipedia, "a military force with law enforcement duties among the civilian population.". Ditto for spain Guardia Civil, and many of the countries listed in that same wiki page: Alg…

Those are bad too. Anyone that grew up in a country with a gendarmerie knows they are the most violent, unpleasant and fascist (personally, not like "all cops are fascist") people you’ll ever meet.

Re: Marines being mobilized in response to LA protests

#417

Post by FirmwareBurner »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #233
Larrikin wrote: post #224

If illegal immigration is such a problem, why not fine businesses 5x salary for using the labor, for as long as it was used? There are a lot of systems in place to verify working status at this point. It eliminates any incentive to hire this cheaper labor willing to work for lower wages. The people coming will be coming for a variety of reasons but it won't be to take the jobs of the uneducated Americans

This is what Canada mostly does and it’s super effective, the problem is that the people who employ illegal immigrants: farmers, construction contractors, hotel owners, etc…belong to the same party pushing against illegal immigration, they would basically be punishing themselves, so it isn’t going to happen.

Doesn't post-pandemic Canada have the highest rate of legal immigration in years since government gives out immigration visas like candy? I can't see how this is good in a country that already has a stagnating economy and a housing crisis. You're eroding the bargaining power of local labor and increasing competition for housing in an already tight market.

Re: Marines being mobilized in response to LA protests

#418

Post by bradley13 »

Using the National Guard is clearly justified. Using the national military (in the case, the Marines) is...highly questionable.

That said, California should have been on top of this situation. It looks like Newsom is willing to sacrifice the safety of his citizens in an attempt to score political points.

Re: Marines being mobilized in response to LA protests

#419

Post by bigbacaloa »

Larrikin wrote: post #224

If illegal immigration is such a problem, why not fine businesses 5x salary for using the labor, for as long as it was used? There are a lot of systems in place to verify working status at this point. It eliminates any incentive to hire this cheaper labor willing to work for lower wages. The people coming will be coming for a variety of reasons but it won't be to take the jobs of the uneducated Americans

[dead]

Re: Marines being mobilized in response to LA protests

#420

Post by spiderfarmer »

davidguetta wrote: post #414
CobrastanJorji wrote: post #358

Because the CNN article seems to have accidentally omitted it, allow me to paste the full text of 18 U.S. Code § 1385, the Posse Comitatus Act: > Whoever, except in cases and under circumstances expressly authorized by the Constitution or Act of Congress, willfully uses any part of the Army, the Navy, the Marine Corps, the Air Force, or the Space Force as a posse comitatus or otherwise to execute the laws shall be fi…

> except in cases and under circumstances expressly authorized by the Constitution or Act of Congress They are arguing there's an insurrenction in California.

There isn't. So don't repeat this 'argument' like it has any substance whatsoever.
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