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Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

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Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#411

Post by heyoni »

sowbug wrote: post #196
codeptualize wrote: post #126

That is wild. It's a good thing as it means Adobe won't ruin Figma like they did with so many great software products before, but just imagine founders, investors and employees, thinking they had a really good exit.. That must hurt, I hope they can stay motivated. If Adobe can't buy them, what other exit options do they have? Go public?

What's wrong with selling goods and services for more than they cost?

I think the issue is that when you buy up your competition there’s nothing stopping you from charging obscene prices in either direction. Charge low to wipe out potential competitors then high when there’s no one left. It very clearly stifles innovation and god knows we don’t regulate monopolies anymore.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#413

Post by pantulis »

spaceman_2020 wrote: post #210
madeofpalk wrote: post #6

Excellent news. I think there should be more products, more companies, and more competition. Adobe just buying up it's competition will only ever directly hurt consumers. See also, "Adobe says the FTC is looking into its subscription cancellation practices." https://www.theverge.com/2023/12/15/24003532/adobe-says-the-...

imo, Adobe is falling behind. Photoshop's generative AI is substantially worse than what I can get from models on Tensorart/CivitAI + an upscaler. It's way easier to produce something that can go live right now without much editing in CivitAI -> Upscale in Magnific -> Add to Canva.

Adobe's vision is fully supporting the content lifecycle, not only the creative aspect. In this sense, Figma made far more sense for Experience Cloud rather than what it gives to Creative Cloud.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#414

Post by cj »

raiyu wrote: post #149

Anyone else think this has nothing to do with the regulatory agencies but instead the market has dramatically shifted in the past 15 months in terms of valuations and this is a nice cover to cancel the deal? Figma still gets $1B "investment" without giving up any equity or control and Adobe gets to walk away from a massive $20B fee. Adobe makes $17B a year in revenue, they would need some pretty strong growth out of…

This sounds on point.

In the small startup M&A market, maybe 50% of deals are falling through? Of the 50% that don't fall through, the vast majority are closing only after being renegotiated in the last hour, e.g. buyers promising to pay $x, but in the last hour the buyer changes their offer to $x/2.(These are deals with zero regulatory review)

Most common issues is buyers backing out because they couldn't secure the debt to finance the deal like they expected they could, multiples decreasing in the market, investor sentiment shifting away from riskier tech ventures, etc.

If those trends in small company M&A also apply to large company M&A, the parent's hypothesis is very valid.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#415

Post by pas »

fairity wrote: post #392

> Fifteen months into the regulatory review process, Figma and Adobe no longer see a path toward regulatory approval How in the world did it take fifteen months for regulators to reject this? That’s an absurdly long time to be operating a business in limbo, and I have to assume it’s the regulators dragging their feet since the companies have every incentive to move quickly. I don’t have an opinion on whether or not t…

we have no idea when they filed what papers where ... and when regulators answered and what, and then how the companies reacted, and when, and ...

on the announcement, Sep 15, Adobe stock fell by 17%. the FTC opened some investigation on Nov 2. some EU thing started its process in February (based on filings by refering countries, and of course we have no idea of the details of those country-level processes)

so, all in all, it's likely that relevant authorities quite soon signaled that Adobe-Figma is facing an uphill battle, and now, as they announced, they backed down.

we have no idea of the negotiations, who was fast or not, who recommended what, asked for what guarantees, and so on.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#416

Post by floren »

Pet_Ant wrote: post #298
madeofpalk wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this is net-negative for consumers, in a pretty significant way. If the most incentivised lifecycle is to seek VC investment to make a non-susitainable product in the hope of being acquired and swallowed into The Borg and shut down, we still end up with less good products. - Product life-cycles become short, consumers are weary of anything new. How many times have you seen product launches here on HN where th…

> If the most incentivised lifecycle is to seek VC investment to make a non-susitainable product in the hope of being acquired and swallowed into The Borg and shut down, we still end up with less good products. "Aim for the moon so if you miss you still end up amongst the stars." The actual _goal_ is to be an independent successful company, but getting bought is the back up option that provides a safety net. If it wa…

But when the most common business plan is "1. Spend VC millions, 2. Acquire non-paying customers, 3. ???, 4. Profit!" it kinda seems like the un-written step 3 is "get acquired by a MAGMA company". You just say something like "oh, we'll get revenue by adding advertising / premium accounts later" as a fig-leaf for the public.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#417

Post by xyzzy4747 »

ceejayoz wrote: post #342
xyzzy4747 wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does that work? I don’t think Adobe has your social security number.

You don't need someone's social security number to send them to collections.

How does it affect your credit score then?

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#418

Post by josefresco »

pier25 wrote: post #119
zukzuk wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I still mourn the end of Freehand. Illustrator’s UI never matched Freehand.

And Fireworks

Fireworks crew in the house! Still use it, although I've tried and tried, and am still trying to transition to Affinity.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#419

Post by api »

danpalmer wrote: post #271
madeofpalk wrote: post #6

Excellent news. I think there should be more products, more companies, and more competition. Adobe just buying up it's competition will only ever directly hurt consumers. See also, "Adobe says the FTC is looking into its subscription cancellation practices." https://www.theverge.com/2023/12/15/24003532/adobe-says-the-...

> Adobe says the FTC is looking into its subscription cancellation practices Great news, where do I testify? Adobe tried to bribe me personally to not fight their subscription cancellation policies for the company I was representing. Given how obviously unimpressed I was with the whole thing and how I was clearly not the target market of a creative cloud subscription, I can only assume that this is a policy that the…

> Adobe tried to bribe me personally to not fight their subscription cancellation policies for the company I was representing.

Is that even legal?

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#420

Post by ghufran_syed »

nolok wrote: post #323
danpalmer wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Adobe says the FTC is looking into its subscription cancellation practices Great news, where do I testify? Adobe tried to bribe me personally to not fight their subscription cancellation policies for the company I was representing. Given how obviously unimpressed I was with the whole thing and how I was clearly not the target market of a creative cloud subscription, I can only assume that this is a policy that the…

Unless you have clear proof of that (saved emails...) and own the company, or you were acting as third party (consultant,...) I would advise not making those accusation in a public place without consulting with their legal representative. It is simply not in your personal interest, and if someone starts an inquiry into this and said company doesn't want to help much you might find yourself in the middle of two legal…

I’m pretty sure adobe is not dumb enough to start a lawsuit that would give the defendant the right to go through their records …
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