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A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

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Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#411

Post by SoftTalker »

justsomehnguy wrote: post #399
SoftTalker wrote: post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A basic, white, 18-20 cu ft refrigerator/freezer can still be purchased new for under $400 in 2023 dollars. In the 1950s, a TV or refrigerator was a major purchase for most families. Therefore there was more concern over quality of materials, repairability, and longevity. Today, a TV is basically a throwaway item. Nobody really repairs them, if you have a problem under warranty you exchange it, or if it's out of warr…

It doesn't helps what there is only the panel itself, circuit board and power cord, basically.

There's still some repairable stuff in most refrigerators.

I have a GE side-by-side refrigerator that's probably 10 years old. It still works, at least as a refrigerator/freezer. The icemaker and water dispenser never worked well and don't work at all now, and at one point started leaking which ruined the laminate floor in the hallway behind the kitchen before it was noticed.

I have replaced the control circuit board, and the freezer defrost heating element. These parts are available and pretty easy to install if you are even slightly skilled as a home handyman, and in the time I've owned it, the need for these repairs doesn't seem unreasonable. The board likely got fried due to a power surge in a thunderstorm, a reminder that most modern appliances should get power through a surge supressor. The defrost heater failure is typical of any frost-free freezer.

I think putting water and icemaker in the freezer is a mistake and won't buy another one like that. If you need more ice than you can make with ice trays, get a standalone ice maker.

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#412

Post by vel0city »

dublin wrote: post #297
rsynnott wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think freon fridges were inherently mechanically any more reliable than fridges using modern refrigerants. If anything slightly less so all else being equal, I'd have thought.

ALL older appliances were way more reliable than any you can buy today. I'm just old enough that all our appliances are from the 1980s, plus a huge chest freezer from the 60s or 70s bought secondhand on Craigslist for $45. They are simple, reliable, faster, and work better than their modern counterparts. Our refrigerator, bought in 1989, has never had any problem at all. They can be easily fixed, and parts are still…

My family had a bunch of 80's appliances. They were terrible feature-wise like the washer would eat my clothes, the dryer was practically either stupid hot or practically no heat, and the fridge didn't have any defrost functionality nor water features. They broke down or were otherwise replaced in the 90s. They were replaced with units with far more features and were good until the 2020s, surviving a few moves. A few even got sold in the end as needs changed.

My current kitchen has a microwave that's from the early 2000s, it works fine and has exceptional even heating and top notch auto sensor modes. The 1980s one we had was a total hunk of junk that constantly had failures, wasn't as powerful, didn't have any sensor cooking modes, and performed very poorly at cooking evenly. The other microwave from the 90s ate fuses for breakfast and had massively unreliable sensor cooking modes.

So for me, practically all my newer appliances are way better than the old ones and have still often lasted >10yrs. Anecdotes are anecdotes.

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#413

Post by Naijoko »

ASalazarMX wrote: post #410
Qwertious wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>* Consumers who care more about convenience and cost above all else, and reliability basically not at all Don't blame the consumer for this. It's just The Market For Lemons at work. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Market_for_Lemons If you really need someone to blame, then blame the MBAs who buy up quality brands and then sell junk until the reputation is all ground up.

Consumers are actually the problem, just as voters are the main cause of bad politicians. Most people will say they want one thing, but actually want another. They want robust appliances, but they will buy the 199.99 ones, which forces even the most honest manufacturer into a race to the bottom, unless they target the luxury segment. An airline which I can't recall, found the same: people say the want more leg room o…

if consumers are the problem. Where can I buy one of those fridge that works for 50 years? Seems like the market is missing quality good.... could this be the problem?

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#414

Post by sireat »

In Europe you can not buy a home vacuum with decent power simply because it is the law.

https://commission.europa.eu/energy-climate-change-environme...

You can argue that the law is well intentioned and even necessary.

The end result is the same, my old cheapo Scarlett 1500W vacuum from 20 years ago does a better job that, AEG, Electrolux and even my new Miele. All of them are hard limited to 900W.

Then again is it really saving power if you spend 2x time using 900W vacuum instead of 1500W one?

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#415

Post by wizofaus »

JeremyNT wrote: post #389
karaterobot wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The other problem is really with consumers. Nobody ever wants to admit that they make bad choices, but this is the most important explanation for why a lot of stuff sucks. If people were willing to pay more for a reliable refrigerator, that's what would get made. In empirical fact, their actual priority is cheapness, so that's what they get.

Except that there's basically no way to know which products are going to be more reliable! You can use price as some kind of signal, but it's only loosely correlated. Manufacturers use a dizzying array of different model numbers that change constantly, so it's impossible to buy a model that's been in the field long enough to have a meaningful track record. You can probably figure out that some brands are basically al…

> Except that there's basically no way to know which products are going to be more reliable!

The fact that basically all manufacturers offer the same fairly pathetic warranties (and that extended ones cost absurd amounts) should give you some idea that basically all products out there are made with similar expectations as to how long they'll last before something breaks.

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#416

Post by Naijoko »

Night_Thastus wrote: post #265
starbugs wrote: post #3

> Thing is, producing crappy, cookie-cutter, uninspired, overpriced junk that falls apart within 5 years (generously speaking) pays more to the shareholders. That's how we got from there to here. This summarizes it quite well for me.

I get a little tired of repeating this, but there are some good reasons why fridges (and most appliances) are the way they are now: * Strong regulation on energy use by appliances (modern fridges are much, much more efficient than ones from 70 years ago) * Extreme competition from companies all over the world * Consumers who care more about convenience and cost above all else, and reliability basically not at all The…

how could it be the consumer if the Industry did fake good products since the begining of time? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned_obsolescence

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#417

Post by maccard »

momirlan wrote: post #374
maccard wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Barring something going horribly wrong, even the cheapest of cheap household appliances will last that, and more. Most major retailers offer longer retailer warranties than that. And, for an absolute bottom of the feature set appliance, a repair shop still exists

maybe in your universe. i lost count of appliances that failed after 1 year, where the vendor is asking for all sorts of pictures and then declares "it's not covered by warranty". repairing such item comes from own pocket, and -if possible - it's usually comparable to paying for it again

For something like a fridge, vacuum, dishwasher, washing machine they're all lasting substantially more than a year, even at the bottom of the market. If you're talking about a £20 blender then... yeah, I guess?

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#418

Post by wizofaus »

keymon-o wrote: post #377
karaterobot wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The other problem is really with consumers. Nobody ever wants to admit that they make bad choices, but this is the most important explanation for why a lot of stuff sucks. If people were willing to pay more for a reliable refrigerator, that's what would get made. In empirical fact, their actual priority is cheapness, so that's what they get.

Do you have any suggestions how at least a single consumer would initiate a demand for reliability? And how would a manufacturer declare and prove they indeed include reliability in their products?

If I could choose between a $1000 appliance with a 10-year warranty and a $500 one with a 5-year warranty I know what I'd go with. But that sort of choice is virtually never available.

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#419

Post by brnt »

jdminhbg wrote: post #305
Qwertious wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>* Consumers who care more about convenience and cost above all else, and reliability basically not at all Don't blame the consumer for this. It's just The Market For Lemons at work. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Market_for_Lemons If you really need someone to blame, then blame the MBAs who buy up quality brands and then sell junk until the reputation is all ground up.

> It's just The Market For Lemons at work. It's not, really. Information about brand reliability is widely available. People just value different things.

> Information about brand reliability is widely available.

Where? If you Google for it, you're only ging to find SEO'd info-free sites. If I take a look at what people tall about in only forums, they haven't a clue either.

I just see no evidence of this.

Re: A fridge from 70 years ago has better features than the fridge I own now

#420

Post by greatfilter251 »

Night_Thastus wrote: post #265
starbugs wrote: post #3

> Thing is, producing crappy, cookie-cutter, uninspired, overpriced junk that falls apart within 5 years (generously speaking) pays more to the shareholders. That's how we got from there to here. This summarizes it quite well for me.

I get a little tired of repeating this, but there are some good reasons why fridges (and most appliances) are the way they are now: * Strong regulation on energy use by appliances (modern fridges are much, much more efficient than ones from 70 years ago) * Extreme competition from companies all over the world * Consumers who care more about convenience and cost above all else, and reliability basically not at all The…

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