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iDOS 2 will be gone soon

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Re: iDOS 2 will be gone soon

#411

Post by qalmakka »

least wrote: post #366
qalmakka wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the very reason I've been buying from "someone else" for almost a decade. Still, in certain markets they are not a "minor" player, and even then that still doesn't give them an excuse to abuse the position. Yes, they are a minor player compared to the WHOLE market, but if you compare only the segments they actually put the effor to compete in, they have quite a large slice and they rake in more profit than any…

> I don't see why the option to sideload stuff onto the iPhone you've bought would make the platform less secure, especially if it is disabled by default and requires explicit user consent to be turned on. You don't see how running any code you want on a device is less secure than restricting the kind of code that you can run? I think the risk is heavily overstated by Apple, but it's a bit inane to claim that it does…

> You don't see how running any code you want on a device is less secure than restricting the kind of code that you can run?

Who's Apple to decide what I consider to be secure or not in my own free will, on my device? It's like saying that guys from Ford have the right to chime in whenever they want and tell me I can't drive my Ford-branded car to a given supermarket chain.

Re: iDOS 2 will be gone soon

#412

Post by ubermonkey »

qalmakka wrote: post #207
ubermonkey wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I very much hope not. If you don't like the way Apple does business, feel free to buy from someone else. They are a minority player in the marketplace by a significant margin; getting all upset about how they manage their platform is a weird, weird look.

That's the very reason I've been buying from "someone else" for almost a decade. Still, in certain markets they are not a "minor" player, and even then that still doesn't give them an excuse to abuse the position. Yes, they are a minor player compared to the WHOLE market, but if you compare only the segments they actually put the effor to compete in, they have quite a large slice and they rake in more profit than any…

"Still, in certain markets they are not a "minor" player, and even then that still doesn't give them an excuse to abuse the position."

1. In which markets does Apple have a majority, i.e. monopoly, position?

2. Given that the answer to point 1 is "none," they have no monopolistic position to abuse.

Special rules only come into play when one player effectively controls an entire market, like MSFT and personal computers in the late 90s.

You don't get to draw the market boundaries in such a way as to establish that Apple has some weird, narrowly defined monopoly.

Re: iDOS 2 will be gone soon

#413

Post by ubermonkey »

alerighi wrote: post #239
ubermonkey wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your bias is showing, as is your blinkered view of what's possible on an iPad. For many, many people, the iPad absolutely DOES replace having a traditional computer. The prediction came true. I rarely bother traveling with a laptop anymore unless I need to present or run demos. My iPad pro + the fancy keyboard case gives me insane portability and battery life plus access to all my files (via Dropbox), native Office,…

To me a PC is a device that runs whatever software you need, and that you can program to do the stuff that you need. iOS imposes limitations on that, you cannot run third party applications that are not on the store, you can't write your own programs or scripts, or you can with 100 limitations that makes it in practice impossible to do so. And I'm not talking about the hardware, it's powerful, probably more powerful…

Your definition of "PC" is really, really narrow, then.

IOW, you're defining "PC" in a way that excludes the thing you don't want to define as a "computer," which amounts to a semantic game, not a description of reality.

For many, many people, an iPad answers all the needs they have. It's a computer.

Re: iDOS 2 will be gone soon

#414

Post by ubermonkey »

alerighi wrote: post #410
8ytecoder wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a very small cohort of people that want to do "whatever they want". Most people do productive stuff within the bounds of what's possible in an iPad - I mean Office/Outlook, Social Media, a full fledged browser with most websites supporting mobile mode now, reading apps, video/entertainment apps, games, social media apps, even corporate vpn apps are readily available. My dev environment is the only one I know of…

Yes, you can use an iPad to connect via remote desktop to a PC somewhere to do serious work. All other things, you can't. Let's talk about office. Try to open a spreadsheet with macros on an iPad, of course you can't, even if Microsoft wants to implement it, that would violate the clause that an application shouldn't run third party code. A lot of companies have spreadsheets with macros to do their administration (I…

The argument isn't that iOS offers everything that a traditional computer does. The argument is that, for many many people and many many use cases, it offers ENOUGH while offering significant advantages over the traditional laptop.

Macros are a corner case. Sure, I use them sometimes, but they're only present in a small minority of my overall spreadsheets. I don't need them on the iPad.

Word functions BEAUTIFULLY on the iPad. I use it ALL THE TIME. Ditto PowerPoint.

"In my country for a couple of sites of some public administration you still need Internet Explorer!"

This is not a problem with the iPad.

Complaining about the email client on the iPad is REALLY rich considering most folks use a webmail client that is even MORE limited. I use iOS mail quite often, and while it can't do everything Outlook can do, it's more than sufficient for most people, and more than sufficient for ME most of the time.

You've made more of a case for "alerighi doesn't like iOS" than you have for "iOS isn't useful for real work," in other words.

Re: iDOS 2 will be gone soon

#415

Post by megous »

calvin_ wrote: post #291
megous wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only thing I wasn't able to do without so far is SMS 2nd factor. Dumbphone is enough for that. I don't mind if banks/govs require use of some protocol. But forcing use of specific apps goes against past achievements to make public institutions use open formats and protocols, so I reject that where possible, or complain. It should not be acceptable. I still remember times when people had to pirate MS office to be…

Most of these apps are just dipping mustards around HOTP/TOTP, so it's a standard protocol. There's an ecosystem of standard applications around it; Twilio, Microsoft, and Google all make pretty popular ones.

That sounds good, as long as the bank API for this is open and documented.

Re: iDOS 2 will be gone soon

#416

Post by least »

qalmakka wrote: post #411
least wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't see why the option to sideload stuff onto the iPhone you've bought would make the platform less secure, especially if it is disabled by default and requires explicit user consent to be turned on. You don't see how running any code you want on a device is less secure than restricting the kind of code that you can run? I think the risk is heavily overstated by Apple, but it's a bit inane to claim that it does…

> You don't see how running any code you want on a device is less secure than restricting the kind of code that you can run? Who's Apple to decide what I consider to be secure or not in my own free will, on my device? It's like saying that guys from Ford have the right to chime in whenever they want and tell me I can't drive my Ford-branded car to a given supermarket chain.

> Who's Apple to decide what I consider to be secure or not in my own free will, on my device?

They're deciding what is secure on their platform that they can be held liable for. Once you buy an iPhone, you can do whatever you want to it. You can hack it, you can smash it with a hammer, you can submerge it deep underwater. There's absolutely no one restricting your free will in any way here. What you are doing is, of your own volition, purchasing a device that you know has software that has built in restrictions, that you may or may not be able to bypass, but it wasn't designed to be, and getting upset that it doesn't behave as it wasn't promised.

The car analogy doesn't hold up. It'd be more akin to buying a car with android auto and being really upset that it doesn't run apple carplay.

Re: iDOS 2 will be gone soon

#417

Post by ubermonkey »

vorpalhex wrote: post #325
8ytecoder wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a very small cohort of people that want to do "whatever they want". Most people do productive stuff within the bounds of what's possible in an iPad - I mean Office/Outlook, Social Media, a full fledged browser with most websites supporting mobile mode now, reading apps, video/entertainment apps, games, social media apps, even corporate vpn apps are readily available. My dev environment is the only one I know of…

I got a phone call from my nephew a few weeks back asking how to mod an NES rom. My wife pretty frequently wants to do simple room diagrams. I'm hosting a game night for an RPG. Everybody needs a laptop - the player software doesn't work in Safari. I frequently pull and add notes to large passages of text. My notes are kept in markdown and in the cloud. This workflow is basically unusable outside of a real computer.…

Your definition of “most” is wrong. MOST people don’t want or need to do any of the things you mention.

BUT let’s talk about them:

1. The ROM. Sure, hardware hacking is probably going to require specialized tools not available in iOS. Most people don’t do this, though.

2. There’s nothing about “simple room diagrams” that suggests this is a task you need a traditional desktop/laptop to do — unless you’re insisting on using a drawing program that only exists on those platforms. No points here.

3. I’m taking your word for it that your software won’t work in Safari, but plenty of us played RPGs for decades without having any computers around at all, and I’ve definitely been party to game nights where an iPad was entirely sufficient.

4. I mostly live in text files, too. You know what works great on my iPad? Text files. No idea what you’ve done to your workflow to make it impossible to do on a tablet, but suffice it to say it’s not an inherent limit to iOS (or, I presume, Android).

All that said, nobody is arguing that YOU should switch tools. But it’s hilariously wrong to insist that iPads aren’t “real” computers, or aren’t capable of handling a broad range of general computing tasks that formerly required full-on laptops or desktops.

Re: iDOS 2 will be gone soon

#418

Post by ubermonkey »

asdff wrote: post #309
8ytecoder wrote: post #294

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. The iPad is leaps and bounds better for casual device use during travel - reading, movies, music, emails, browsing, social media and some casual document editing works just fine on the iPad. Except for the development environment, I don't need to reach for a laptop at all. I can even read code via the Github app. So, unless I know I have to write code, I don't carry my laptop anymore. 10 years (or even 5 year…

Really? I find the laptop still better for that stuff. For the ipad you have to use some clunky folding stand thing. Its awkward to sit there with it on your lap waiting for a flight, or have to hold it up in front of you with one hand and do something with the other. Laptop on the other hand is pretty comfortable on a lap, and macbooks these days don't weigh very much at all.

Key to the use case would be a robust folding keyboard/stand situation. I use the "magic" one from Apple, but there are less spendy competitors available now.

Re: iDOS 2 will be gone soon

#419

Post by eesmith »

eesmith wrote: post #392
selfhoster11 wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I heard KaiOS phones are good, including the "Bananaphone" (aka Nokia 8110 4G) that can be had for very reasonable amounts.

I just ordered a Cat B40 - https://www.catphones.com/en-gb/cat-b40/ . It uses KaiOS. :)

Frustratingly, it doesn't seem to have predictive text/auto-correct. :(
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