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Under the skin of OnlyFans

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411–420 of 615 posts

Re: Under the skin of OnlyFans

#411
post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I believe that making sex work illegal and driving it back underground is not helping that conversation. I never indicated either of these would be solutions. I don't believe elevating sex work to a pedestal in the cultural consciousness is right or ethical. That is primarily what I am taking issue with. It can be lucrative but the toll on young women, often very young women, can be great. It's a damaging professio…

> It's a damaging profession both to its consumers and to its creators With age and life experience, I'm actually finding it increadibly difficult to agree with this statement. Sex work might be damaging for many providers, that's for sure (although, as others mentioned, so are other professions deemed essential); but damaging for consumers, I don't know. If it were so bad, it wouldn't be "the oldest profession". (Ma…

I spent my early twenties in Buddhist monasteries. What I learned at the foot of these peaceful, shockingly kind monks was that the mind is all habits spun on the flywheel of action.

"Whatever a monk keeps pursuing with his thinking & pondering, that becomes the inclination of his awareness. If a monk keeps pursuing thinking imbued with sensuality, abandoning thinking imbued with renunciation, his mind is bent by that thinking imbued with sensuality."

We have a choice every time a thought, a desire, a feeling comes to us. We can follow it, pursue it, foment it. Or we can see it, acknowledge it, and drop it. People will do what they want and never have I advocated we tell people they can't do with their bodies whatever they want to do with them. But we can encourage a wiser eye in our consumption.

Re: Under the skin of OnlyFans

#412
post #74

Fire up the throwaway! Not 100% related to the article, but directly related. I worked as developer for a product in the same niche ("democratizing adult content"). I spent almost 2 years working on the frontend, devops, and building out the analytics engine (all pre-covid). Anyway, on to the comment at hand. We had a small number of users compared to OnlyFans (when I left, there were about 20K active content creator…

I think in general there are some pretty big costs that aren't fully understood to doing sex work, even outside of the social stigma of being found out by your friends and family, there are mental health costs that are often not talked about. A lot of sex workers overtly reinforce social behaviors towards women (sexualization and objectification among other things) in order to appeal to men, which hurts them in the l…

I think you're mostly describing social stigma in your points.

Re: Under the skin of OnlyFans

#413

Who could have possibly predicted that a company which mechanized the process of targeting and turning young teenage girls into prostitutes would have a dark side? If onlyfans happened in person, the people behind it would be in prison. They market to teenagers, and as soon as they turn 18 encourage them to prostitute themselves to men over the internet. It is a disgusting, horrible company that we should be ashamed…

You have to be 18 to sign up. It's like saying the military is a mechanized process turning young men into troops. Some people sign up for the military before they graduate high school, and gladly. There has to be some arbitrary age where a boys and girls become an adult, when they can and must accept responsibility.

Re: Under the skin of OnlyFans

#414

Fire up the throwaway! Not 100% related to the article, but directly related. I worked as developer for a product in the same niche ("democratizing adult content"). I spent almost 2 years working on the frontend, devops, and building out the analytics engine (all pre-covid). Anyway, on to the comment at hand. We had a small number of users compared to OnlyFans (when I left, there were about 20K active content creator…

The creators would somehow be surprised when they realised we couldn't remove content from other websites.

Don't you have skin in this, too? I would expect that you would want to protect your content in much the same way a film studio protects their content when it pops up on 3rd party sites. I don't know if you're being obtuse with your wording here, but whether or not your customers realized that you can't physically remove content from others sites directly is beside the point when there are well known legal options.

Re: Under the skin of OnlyFans

#415

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My best friend is a cam model and could really use therapy, but she has no insurance. What cam site provides therapy? My friend works for MFC, and is a "contractor", not an employee.

Can you give me a method of contacting you? Can be a throwaway email.

gdrew686 at gmail dot com

Thanks so much. Its awesome to know there is a site that cares enough about their models to provide support for therapy.

Re: Under the skin of OnlyFans

#416
Made a throwaway to post this.

For various reasons I happen to know personally many (>10) women who've created an OnlyFans or otherwise participate in online sex work. I know these people well enough that we discuss things like our mental health state / conditions. One commonality that I have found is that many of the women who start an OF are already suffering from a mental health condition that has as a symptom hypersexuality or a need for attention / attention-seeking behaviors. One of the more common diagnosed mental health issues these women have is bipolar disorder, where in their manic states they experience hypersexuality.

One perspective is that online sex work provides a monetarily lucrative outlet for urges these women have to cope with regardless of their participation online. On the other hand, the consequences for online sex work to your "regular" life are much more far-reaching vs expressing these urges with individuals in person.

Of a bigger concern to me is that my conversations with these women have indicated that participating in OnlyFans actually deepens their trauma and mental health issues and may exacerbate their attention-seeking behaviors. Many of them have a traumatic past which directly ties into their relationships with men and sex, and participating in OF reinforces the outcomes of that trauma rather than providing them a pathway to reforge how they structure relationships with men and how they think about sex in their lives. Being involved in online sex work can be deeply traumatizing for the workers, and it is tied directly into the fact that they're both selling attention while seeking attention, and the facsimile but not the reality of a human emotional connection.

I don't know what the answer is, but I really wish that in the US we had universal healthcare including for mental healthcare. There are whole generations of women who are deeply traumatized by their upbringing and the lack of strong male role models in their lives. The epidemic of single motherhood across demographic boundaries within the US has massively contributed to our current mental healthcare crisis, and lack of a father figure that is a /good/ father heavily contributes to broken relationship models with men for these women.

Re: Under the skin of OnlyFans

#417
post #249
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think in general there are some pretty big costs that aren't fully understood to doing sex work, even outside of the social stigma of being found out by your friends and family, there are mental health costs that are often not talked about. A lot of sex workers overtly reinforce social behaviors towards women (sexualization and objectification among other things) in order to appeal to men, which hurts them in the l…

Sexualisation is a reflection of society. Ask women what they experience if they show up to work without makeup. In my view, onlyfans is a net positive for society. Would you rather like sex trafficking? Because face it, humans have hormones, and our social norms encourage men to go for status and women for appearance. These facts create the atmosphere for sex work.

You can still have sex trafficking with OnlyFans in the mix, that's where the paying customers are and gangs will exploit that. Especially if it's easy to sign up.

Re: Under the skin of OnlyFans

#418

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m sorry for your wife. However, I think it’s dangerous to shape the conversation about sex work solely around such cases. A person from my old flat share was a nurse on a terminal cancer ward for mostly children. > 90% of the patients died. They burned out within two years on the job. My aunt had to quit her job as hospital nurse because it physically ruined her body. She’s still suffering from that, decades later.…

> I believe that making sex work illegal and driving it back underground is not helping that conversation. I never indicated either of these would be solutions. I don't believe elevating sex work to a pedestal in the cultural consciousness is right or ethical. That is primarily what I am taking issue with. It can be lucrative but the toll on young women, often very young women, can be great. It's a damaging professio…

This sounds about right. I think there's a growing consensus that making criminals of the workers doesn't help (you might lightly criminalize the buy side in some cases, but criminalizing the sell-side makes it harder to help workers who get in trouble), and I appreciate the discussion from any political corner that helps make that point.

On the other hand it's also weird to me to see progressive elements talk of normalizing such a personal commodification -- perhaps like some progressives, I am not sure there is as big a difference as we'd like to believe between selling one's spring days to be a cog in any commercial operation and selling participation in sexual gratification. But nobody talks of normalizing or glorifying the former! On the other hand, no one stigmatizes being a cog in a commercial operation. Maybe what's going on is that it's hard to argue for the dignity of removing personalized stigma without overcorrecting.

So the solution is probably conversations (like this one) elaborating on the dynamics of the ways it can go wrong. No one's freedom to choose or dignity if they choose sex work is hurt by clear-eyed explanations of the hazards.

Re: Under the skin of OnlyFans

#419

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the heart of the difference between the two statements: - The average streamer makes $x - Streamers make an average of $y

Sorry, whats the difference here? -avg streamer makes $x. Total = $x * # streamers -streamers make an average of $y. Total = $y * # streamers Average is always sum/n?

A streamer that is considered average - has an average number of followers and subscribers - could be expected to make about $X.

The average income of all streamers (including super popular streamers and streamers with 1 follower) makes is $y. Because the streamers in the top 1% make several orders of magnitude more money, $y is skewed higher than $x.

Re: Under the skin of OnlyFans

#420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An important distinction is that if you think that work under capitalism isn't exploitative you take on assumptions that make it very hard to argue that sex work is. It's hard to argue that being a coal miner for example isn't exploitative despite irreversible and severe, often deadly, harm to your body, but selling pictures on onlyfans is exploitative. Ultimately the vast majority of work requires you trade away you…

Coal mining and sex work are hardly representative examples of "all work." We all lose our youth and our health, it's inevitable whether we work or not. Yes ultimately your employer feels that they are getting more value from your work than it is costing them, otherwise there would be no point in employing you. It's a real stretch to argue that is exploitative even in most cases (to say nothing of all work).

Most work in the world is closer to Coal Mining I'm afraid.

Losing your health by working 40+ hours a week is much worse than the baseline.

As far as the extraction of value not being exploitative, this argument simply applies to literally every condition of exploitation, and it is very possible to be employed without having a dominant superior. It would be good for you to arrive to a better definition of exploitation, otherwise plainly most relationships of employment do involve some sort of exploitation.

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