Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Signal adds a payments feature with a privacy-focused cryptocurrency

wired.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

411–420 of 665 posts

Re: Signal adds a payments feature with a privacy-focused cryptocurrency

#411

Post by hn8788 »

Klonoar wrote: post #324
hn8788 wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Signal may not own any MobileCoins, but the CEO of MobileCoin said: > MobileCoin has not yet paid Signal anything for integrating MobileCoin. We intend to donate a great deal of money to Signal over the coming years.

Yes, I've read that. I find it a stretch to draw that conclusion though, as if it's some back door deal for funding. For all the criticisms of cryptocurrency (and I have many...), I don't particularly see anything on MobileCoin's work that indicates the usual shady cryptocurrency stuff. I'm not sure it belongs in Signal, but I do think this stuff can be evaluated without people starting conspiracy theories.

The CEO said:

> I love Signal and I started MobileCoin to help fund their work.

I don't see how it's a conspiracy theory that this is a backdoor way of funding Signal when the CEO literally says that MobileCoin was created as a way to fund Signal.

Re: Signal adds a payments feature with a privacy-focused cryptocurrency

#412

Post by marcinzm »

Igelau wrote: post #385
josh2600 wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, this is just what happens when you try to hit the page from a US IP address.

Why are you blocking the US?

I'm guessing because they don't want an SEC investigation into whatever they're running.

Re: Signal adds a payments feature with a privacy-focused cryptocurrency

#413

Post by marcinzm »

Klonoar wrote: post #324
hn8788 wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Signal may not own any MobileCoins, but the CEO of MobileCoin said: > MobileCoin has not yet paid Signal anything for integrating MobileCoin. We intend to donate a great deal of money to Signal over the coming years.

Yes, I've read that. I find it a stretch to draw that conclusion though, as if it's some back door deal for funding. For all the criticisms of cryptocurrency (and I have many...), I don't particularly see anything on MobileCoin's work that indicates the usual shady cryptocurrency stuff. I'm not sure it belongs in Signal, but I do think this stuff can be evaluated without people starting conspiracy theories.

It's not a conspiracy when it's all out in the open. Calling things you don't like a conspiracy theory to discredit them is a poor form of argument.

A bunch of decently well of people decided to do a few handshake deals to make each other a whole bunch of money. That's how most of the world rolls so this is simply par for course.

Re: Signal adds a payments feature with a privacy-focused cryptocurrency

#414

Post by XorNot »

doggosphere wrote: post #273
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No. Your shares were _diluted_ by the company issuing new shares. Now your 100 shares are worth half as much. That's not correct. A company sells shares in exchange for cash. That cash is owned by the company, which is represented by the shares. Companies can't simply dilute away their shareholders like you're suggesting. The money raised by selling shares doesn't simply disappear.

I own 10% of a company. Several rounds later, I now own 2% of the company. It is possible the company is now valued higher or lower than what I got in at. Did I get diluted?

The concept of "non-voting shares" exists, so the answer is "maybe, depending what you value".

Re: Signal adds a payments feature with a privacy-focused cryptocurrency

#415

Post by demux »

meowfly wrote: post #195

The comment from the article echos my own sentiments: > Speaking solely as a person who is really into encrypted messaging, it terrifies me that they're going to take this really clean story of an encrypted messenger and mix it up with the nightmare of laws and regulations and vulnerability that is cryptocurrency. Moreover, there are three other points I'd add: 1. I don't like "do everything" apps like WeChat or Line…

Perhaps the onus is on you to change your opinion on crypto, regardless of whether it belongs in Signal or not.

Re: Signal adds a payments feature with a privacy-focused cryptocurrency

#416

Post by Klonoar »

hn8788 wrote: post #411
Klonoar wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I've read that. I find it a stretch to draw that conclusion though, as if it's some back door deal for funding. For all the criticisms of cryptocurrency (and I have many...), I don't particularly see anything on MobileCoin's work that indicates the usual shady cryptocurrency stuff. I'm not sure it belongs in Signal, but I do think this stuff can be evaluated without people starting conspiracy theories.

The CEO said: > I love Signal and I started MobileCoin to help fund their work. I don't see how it's a conspiracy theory that this is a backdoor way of funding Signal when the CEO literally says that MobileCoin was created as a way to fund Signal.

Yeah, I don't really see anything particularly wrong with that. I'd be more bothered by it if Signal wasn't a nonprofit.

Is it potentially a bad business model? Yeah. Is it necessarily some backdoor funding deal? I dunno, I don't really buy it.

Re: Signal adds a payments feature with a privacy-focused cryptocurrency

#417

Post by 3np »

ac29 wrote: post #200
lrvick wrote: post #84

Signal is still centrally controlled and compiled by a single entity and distributed only in an unsigned insecure form or in a signed/verified manner only if you give up your privacy to install with Google Play or the Apple store. Those that only run open source software like myself have no secure way to run Signal short of compiling every release by hand which is impractical. Moxie has stated he will not support any…

> Not to mention you need to show government ID to get a SIM to use the Signal wallet for said private currency/messenger in 200 countries. There are less than 200 countries in total, unless you get very creative with states that are arent recognized more more than a handful of other countries, like Abkhazia or Transnistria. You also dont need ID to buy SIM cards in the US, so I'm curious on how valid this assertion…

In the past two countries I lived, it’s currently impossible for an individual to get a SIM card that can do voice or SMS without government ID and being a resident. Data-only SIMs can be bought for cash easily, but that doesn’t help you with Signal.

The same goes for virtual/VoIP numbers. No skypein etc.

Re: Signal adds a payments feature with a privacy-focused cryptocurrency

#418

Post by Klonoar »

marcinzm wrote: post #413
Klonoar wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I've read that. I find it a stretch to draw that conclusion though, as if it's some back door deal for funding. For all the criticisms of cryptocurrency (and I have many...), I don't particularly see anything on MobileCoin's work that indicates the usual shady cryptocurrency stuff. I'm not sure it belongs in Signal, but I do think this stuff can be evaluated without people starting conspiracy theories.

It's not a conspiracy when it's all out in the open. Calling things you don't like a conspiracy theory to discredit them is a poor form of argument. A bunch of decently well of people decided to do a few handshake deals to make each other a whole bunch of money. That's how most of the world rolls so this is simply par for course.

>It's not a conspiracy when it's all out in the open. Calling things you don't like a conspiracy theory to discredit them is a poor form of argument.

This statement would work better if that's what I was doing, but I'm not.

You (and nobody else) on this thread knows for sure what's going on there, and if Moxie's been advising MobileCoin for years I don't see how it falls under a handshake deal.

There is nothing to indicate that he, or Signal, are directly profiting from this, other than some MobileCoin people saying they want to donate to Signal (which is a good thing - I'm really not bothered by that particular point).

Re: Signal adds a payments feature with a privacy-focused cryptocurrency

#419

Post by qotgalaxy »

psychlops wrote: post #403
anonporridge wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By this definition, every company stock is a multi-level marketing pyramid scheme. In fact, company stock is WAY worse, because the majority of people are legally prohibited from investing in private companies unless they're an accredited investor (already rich). So, only rich people (other than founders and early employees) are allowed to buy in at super low prices before handing off the bag to the public.

Also, it would include fiat currency as a scheme as those who print it do so at negligible prices.

No, not really.

Re: Signal adds a payments feature with a privacy-focused cryptocurrency

#420

Post by jude- »

leppr wrote: post #350
gruez wrote: post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point is that in your initial comment, you were saying that with decentralized cryptocurrencies you'll be free from third party interference, but with ETH the DAO hacker was subject to the very interference you claimed crypto wasn't subject to. Therefore it weakens your claim from something like "with crypto, nobody can stop you!", to "with crypto, nobody can stop you! ...except if you do something we don't like…

A hard fork in a decentralized cryptocurrency is democratic, users chose which of the 2 new chains assets' they want to keep. No binary winner is decided, the market currently values ETH as 122 times more valuable than ETC, but ETC is not censored. The sentencing of criminals in republics is very removed from democratic action (see drug criminalization).

> A hard fork in a decentralized cryptocurrency is democratic, users chose which of the 2 new chains assets' they want to keep.

Show us the votes, then. Did a majority of miners and/or coinholders vote to hard-fork?

Post reply on HN