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Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

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Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#411

Post by conjectures »

amelius wrote: post #408
mcv wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only company I would trust with home automation at this point is IKEA. They're the only ones doing this who are actually in the business of making their customers' homes nice, rather than collecting and monetizing their customers' data. (And now I'm half expecting someone to respond that IKEA also collects our data. I don't know if they do, and I'd expect them not to, but I'd really like to know if they do.)

It's a company. With shareholders. Even if you can trust them now, that's no guarantee for the future. Trusting companies is just silly.

I realise this is an opinion du jour around here now, but it's a pretty paranoid take on the market economy.

I trust that if I buy a can of coke, it will contain coke because coke want to keep selling me coke. They don't need to be good people, they just have to care about making money in the future. The fact that I think they care about that is why I can trust that the can of coke in fact contains coke with high probability.

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#412

Post by dna_polymerase »

amelius wrote: post #408
mcv wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only company I would trust with home automation at this point is IKEA. They're the only ones doing this who are actually in the business of making their customers' homes nice, rather than collecting and monetizing their customers' data. (And now I'm half expecting someone to respond that IKEA also collects our data. I don't know if they do, and I'd expect them not to, but I'd really like to know if they do.)

It's a company. With shareholders. Even if you can trust them now, that's no guarantee for the future. Trusting companies is just silly.

> It's a company. With shareholders.

It's owned by a dutch foundation which serves to "promote and support innovation in the field of architectural and interior design" (via [0]). Oh and something about kids in developing countries.

[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stichting_INGKA_Foundation

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#413

Post by AniseAbyss »

mcv wrote: post #403
deepstack wrote: post #396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the company is also doing some sketchy things in the smart home space under their brand "Aqara" The whole idea of connecting everything to the internet is getting out of hand. 1. Internet and digital infrastructure has no integrity as how it is currently. 2. Anything for home, machinery, all should work when there is NO internet connection. Just like an app should work (to some extend) in airplane mode. It really com…

The only company I would trust with home automation at this point is IKEA. They're the only ones doing this who are actually in the business of making their customers' homes nice, rather than collecting and monetizing their customers' data. (And now I'm half expecting someone to respond that IKEA also collects our data. I don't know if they do, and I'd expect them not to, but I'd really like to know if they do.)

IKEA is a European company. Can't trust America- its bought and payed for by corporations- and the Chinese are enigmatic- who knows what they want?

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#414

Post by amelius »

dna_polymerase wrote: post #412
amelius wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a company. With shareholders. Even if you can trust them now, that's no guarantee for the future. Trusting companies is just silly.

> It's a company. With shareholders. It's owned by a dutch foundation which serves to "promote and support innovation in the field of architectural and interior design" (via [0]). Oh and something about kids in developing countries. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stichting_INGKA_Foundation

IKEA has a complex corporate structure which was created specifically because of the high Swedish taxes. Hence the Dutch connection.

Also, read the criticisms section of that link. Only after publication of the criticism in the Economist did the family who owns IKEA take action. Now imagine what happens if the family has less control in the future. Also, supporting innovation and supporting developing countries does not mean "don't track users", etc.

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#415

Post by amelius »

conjectures wrote: post #411
amelius wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a company. With shareholders. Even if you can trust them now, that's no guarantee for the future. Trusting companies is just silly.

I realise this is an opinion du jour around here now, but it's a pretty paranoid take on the market economy. I trust that if I buy a can of coke, it will contain coke because coke want to keep selling me coke. They don't need to be good people, they just have to care about making money in the future. The fact that I think they care about that is why I can trust that the can of coke in fact contains coke with high pro…

> I trust that if I buy a can of coke, it will contain coke because coke want to keep selling me coke.

Perhaps but if the company could sell you more coke by having your personal data, it would be silly to assume they would not explore that route.

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#416

Post by einpoklum »

conjectures wrote: post #411
amelius wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a company. With shareholders. Even if you can trust them now, that's no guarantee for the future. Trusting companies is just silly.

I realise this is an opinion du jour around here now, but it's a pretty paranoid take on the market economy. I trust that if I buy a can of coke, it will contain coke because coke want to keep selling me coke. They don't need to be good people, they just have to care about making money in the future. The fact that I think they care about that is why I can trust that the can of coke in fact contains coke with high pro…

> I trust that if I buy a can of coke, it will contain coke because coke want to keep selling me coke

You don't even know what coke is, since that formula is kept secret (well, Coca Cola's at least). Also, in some countries, you'll get high-fructose corn syrup instead of cane sugar, which is believed to increase the risk of fatty liver disease, obesity etc. (caveat: Some believe the evidence is not conclusive enough for certainty.)

And why don't they just "sell you coke" everywhere? Because it makes them more money. And the raison d'etre of a commercial company/corporation is pecuniary gain. Profiting. Making money. Management is obligated to act so as to maximize profit (under legal obligations etc. etc.)

This brings us to your first point:

> it's a pretty paranoid take on the market economy.

No, it's literally what commercial companies' charters and fundamental structure requires. No conspiracy theory or paranoia.

In context of spying - if the company has determined their profits would improve by them spying on you, and that they can get away with it - then it's pretty likely they will indeed spy on you.

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#417

Post by AniseAbyss »

melomal wrote: post #407
kwanbix wrote: post #391

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course (almost?) no government is a saint. However, China is a totalitarian non-democratic government. I would fear the Chinese government much more than the US or UK governments, for example. But I might be too naive.

> I would fear the Chinese government If you are outside of China then surely there is nothing to really be scared of? What could the Chinese government do with your data that could cause harm? I get it's the principle but ultimately we are all scared of sharing our data with China and I am not sure why?

I don't get it either. Whenever someone uses the words "the West" I cringe because because every goddamn privacy invasion has come from our friendly American overlords. Who I might ad are not just like us.

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#418

Post by a_imho »

trasz wrote: post #226
monkeyingaround wrote: post #60

Xiaomi phones are insane, at least BlackShark. They replace virtually all the major user level stuff of Android with extreme data collecting alternatives. They then make it so that you cannot disable many of them (via adp, custom ROMs etc.) without bricking the phone, I'm talking wallpaper or clock apps that run with full, non-modifiable privileges. They subsidize cheap hardware with truly insane level of tracking. T…

So how is it different from a regular Android again?

A run of the mill iphone is much worse in that regard.

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#419

Post by krageon »

conjectures wrote: post #411
amelius wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a company. With shareholders. Even if you can trust them now, that's no guarantee for the future. Trusting companies is just silly.

I realise this is an opinion du jour around here now, but it's a pretty paranoid take on the market economy. I trust that if I buy a can of coke, it will contain coke because coke want to keep selling me coke. They don't need to be good people, they just have to care about making money in the future. The fact that I think they care about that is why I can trust that the can of coke in fact contains coke with high pro…

> market economy

If your argument for the market economy working in a way that shouldn't inspire paranoia is based on trust and distinguished consumer choice, you've not been paying attention to world news or you're arguing in bad faith.

Re: Are Xiaomi browsers spyware? Yes, they are (2020)

#420

Post by ethbr0 »

xtian wrote: post #266
ethbr0 wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That was ATT. It (and all the other exposed operations) hardly support the statement that "all telecom companies and very likely all major tech companies are spying for the US government" .

The US defense and intelligence apparatuses have been deeply intertwined with private enterprise for many decades. This is a matter of historical fact. But I totally understand if it's more comfortable for you to believe that now things are different despite the fact that no one was ever held to account for what happened in the past.

There is no proof that I'm aware of that all telecom companies and very likely all major tech companies are spying for the US goverent.

To be clear, evidence that some telecoms have, or that some major tech companies have is insufficient.

Extrapolating some into all is unreasonable. Do you have more proof it's the latter?

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