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Tesla Software Version 10.0

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Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#411

Post by RealWorldPolice »

leesec wrote: post #351
tw04 wrote: post #326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But they aren't. The car doesn't drive itself yet and you shouldn't pretend it does unless you want to die. Other than performance and range they haven't hit on ANY of the high order bits.

Haha well, maybe your car doesn't drive itself. Mine does everyday, it's great. Also Teslas are the safest cars. Not sure what you're talking about

I don't believe you. I own an AP1 Tesla as well as a nominally "FSD computer equipped" AP2 Tesla.

You would be injured or killed if you tried taking an unmonitored trip of any reasonable length - ON THE HIGHWAY - in either, with autopilot on and with the nag disabled using a weight. If you think you don't have to routinely make manual corrections to save yourself from dying I think you are either lying or delusional.

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#412

Post by xedeon »

RealWorldPolice wrote: post #408
xedeon wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then you don't like it? Cool! It's not the end of the world I promise. You can still buy whatever car you want. Why don't you let people buy what they please with their hard earned money?

That's nothing like what they said. They are not telling people what to buy. They are trying to understand the willingness of many Tesla owners to brush off being misled and ignored by the manufacturer of their car, and to do things like you just did. I own a P100D and the magic wore off for me. Apparently it hasn't for you. Peace.

> Tesla owners to brush off being misled and ignored by the manufacturer of their car

Huh? how so, can you provide examples?

> I own a P100D and the magic wore off for me. Apparently it hasn't for you.

It certainly hasn't, to the point that we got rid all of our gas vehicles for a 3/X (Owned an S since 2015). Also, four of our neighbors also randomly rang our doorbell in the last 6 months asking about the cars. An underrated feature of these cars is safety, I can't put a price on that.

I showed them the features, gave them test drives and told them my honest opinion and experience. A few weeks later, they all ended up buying one.

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#414

Post by Phillipharryt »

xedeon wrote: post #52
icelancer wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same. The Tesla Model 3 is great. I'd get one if I didn't have crushing doubt about their ability to service their cars. Or stay in business long-term.

> I'd get one if I didn't have crushing doubt about their ability to service their cars. Or stay in business long-term. Are you serious? That false narrative fueled by FUD has been the talking point by short-sellers since 2008 (Only Tesla and Ford survived the 2008 market crash btw). It's now 2019 and you would think people would know any better.

Tesla bonds are rated deeeep into junk. Comparatively Toyota is high in the investment grade as are VW's. Having junk long term bonds is not great, having junk short term ones is downright scary. This is even worse considering it's a company that so desperately needs the ability to get cheap loans. It's not a narrative without its facts, it's a speculation based on concerning evidence.

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#415

Post by RealWorldPolice »

bobsil1 wrote: post #402
fortran77 wrote: post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can get a Chevy Bolt with perfect fit and finish! 100% of Tesla 3 owners would get an "S" if only they could afford it.

S is a different body size entirely, and Model 3 has some more advanced tech (e.g. more power-efficient) until S refreshed. 3 is actually cannibalizing S sales.

Perhaps I'm missing something, but how does anyone know that it's "cannibalizing" S sales rather than just "S sales are down?"

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#416

Post by RealWorldPolice »

binaryblitz wrote: post #213
Shivetya wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Owner of a Tesla model 3. Summon is the canary in the coal mine. As in, unless it shows signs of life then the fairy tale of self driving cars is just that, a fairy tale. If they cannot get a safe an accurate summon to work why should I ever believe my car will ever drive on its own. Do I believe it will come, not for years. My car cannot even identify a speed limit sign, maybe version 10 will help on that. I doubt i…

I rented a model three for a week long trip, and while I understand some of your frustrations, a lot of them are not the norm from my experience. Both speed limit sign detection, and self driving on the freeway worked flawlessly for me. I guess YMMV.

There is no speed limit sign detection...

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#417

Post by Phillipharryt »

mediaman wrote: post #166
navigatesol wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

False narrative? The "narrative" is their financial data. The fact that there is so much capital floating around to keep bad businesses afloat doesn't make them good businesses. I'm sure the shady silicon valley dealings are isolated to WeWork, even though Tesla is being sued for similar self-dealing. Good luck!

If you take a closer look at their financial data, you'll find that it's quite a bit better than what people repeat. In Fiscal Year 2018, they had positive operating cash flow of $2.1 billion. Part of the reason for the difference between accounting earnings (a loss) and actual cash flow is the huge depreciation charges ($1.9 billion) for historical capital expenditures, versus present-day cash outflows. In that year…

For a company not at significant financial risk why is their credit rating so low? Investors shouldn't be concerned about repayment if Tesla is likely to remain solvent.

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#418

Post by xedeon »

rainyMammoth wrote: post #234
damon_c wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not that complicated. Drive one and you will see that they are pretty different from any other car in a number of ways.

Why would you assume that if I drive one I would automatically like it? I drove one for a couple days. It is a nice experience but a very early product that is far from perfect and the finish was what I would have expected for a cheap Toyota.

> Why would you assume that if I drive one I would automatically like it?

Because that seems to be the consensus among us owners who give test drives during Tesla meetups. Also add neighbors to the mix who ask about the cars.

I now referred 6 people this way. Not once in 34 years have I had given test drives in my previous (mostly german) cars or other people become curious enough to knock on my door.

Surely, there's something interesting going on here isn't there?

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#419

Post by _ph_ »

rainyMammoth wrote: post #338
revscat wrote: post #332

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This view about the inevitability of LIDAR seems to become increasingly anachronistic as time goes on. I have autopilot. Two nights ago it drove me from the entrance ramp to the exit ramp for my destination, approximately 30 miles, and I didn’t have to intervene once. The route involved three different highways, two overpasses, requisite lane changes, and even a brief stint through a traffic jam where it had to merge…

Everyone agrees that you can do 99.99% of the driving without a LIDAR. That's exactly what you did yesterday in easy conditions (Highway driving is the easiest environment by far). The issue if you want to go to FULL self driving is that you need to go to 99.99999% of reliability which a lot of experts agree you will not be able to do without Lidar. Here is the issue: Video cameras will work properly most of the time…

LIDAR gives you precision distance measurements. But LIDAR helps you little, if anything, with object classification. And object classification, the understanding what the car sees, is the big challenge with self driving.

Yes, with semi-intelligent systems it gives a head-start, as you can reasonably easy detect obstacles, but it does not help in understanding how to react to the detected obstacles.

So I would consider LIDAR rather a system which at the current state of development helps with collision avoidance rather than with true self-driving.

Re: Tesla Software Version 10.0

#420

Post by xedeon »

kaiwen1 wrote: post #413

The depth and breadth of anti-Tesla sentiment in HN threads is curious. It's rarely from owners. By all satisfaction surveys, owners love their Teslas.

It's very intriguing indeed... I always thought the HN demographic is a pretty smart bunch, because I often learn quite a bit from the comment section.

I don't get all of the anti-Tesla vitriol, I'm honestly curious what fuels it. It's like all objectivity get's thrown out the window.

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