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California passes bill that classifies gig economy workers as employees

nytimes.com

411–420 of 754 posts

Re: California passes bill that classifies gig economy workers as employees

#411
post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

is this supposed to be an unintended consequence? We all know that the cheap rides of Uber are (partially) the result of them dodging around employer obligations.

I disagree with this. What other job on the planet allows me to work when I want to work, bring my own tools, have no boss, and never even talk to the company I am working for?

I dont understand why your comment is being downvoted. It is sad

Re: California passes bill that classifies gig economy workers as employees

#412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Experts said that there is nothing in the bill that requires employees to work set shifts, and that Uber and Lyft are legally entitled to continue allowing drivers to make their own scheduling decisions. Well yeah, it doesn't force them to. Who are these "experts"? If Uber takes on 100,000 new employees and all of the costs that go along with them, why wouldn't they also manage them like... employees? You can't have…

because then those drivers would go work for lyft or some other company that doesn't do it? I mean this is why we want competition.

It wont be possible for any taxi company to provide minimum hourly wages without enforcing peoples schedules. I mean, a group of drivers could choose to drive only between 22-06 during weekdays and thus get paid minimum wage for basically sleeping in their car.

Re: California passes bill that classifies gig economy workers as employees

#413
post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can think of many different ways to interpret your first sentence, so I'm not clear what you're saying, but this does make me wonder if it's going to lead to any sort of licensing or certification for general industry programmers. If workers in this field want to call themselves "software engineers" and gain the benefits of a professional title, like lawyers and architects, they're going to have to start following…

> If workers in this field want to call themselves "software engineers" and gain the benefits of a professional title What are those benefits?

Quite I looked at going down the CENG route when I worked at BT via the BCS.

1 they kept changing the requirements 2 what are the benefits

ironically as I started on the mech Engineering route I am more an "Engineer" than many other developers

Re: California passes bill that classifies gig economy workers as employees

#414

All these people making Uber money on the side ... the whole thing was possible in part due to the low friction in (and also complete disregard for) the regulatory environment. I’m in NYC and honestly can’t figure out how to legally hire a studio assistant for a few hours a week without being at risk for any of a number of lawsuit vectors. So I just coil my own cables. And I don’t mentor people who want to learn some…

The way to protect workers is to shift the burden of health care and other costly benefits onto the government, supported by taxes. Then there is no risk to hiring a new employee beyond the wages you pay them. The US public does not want this, though, and the war of words over universal health care has led to incredibly deep entrenchment on the side of those opposed. All this despite the mountain of evidence from oth…

I can think of several countries with universal healthcare where hiring is still complicated to say the least. Not arguing it would still help, though!

Re: California passes bill that classifies gig economy workers as employees

#415

All these people making Uber money on the side ... the whole thing was possible in part due to the low friction in (and also complete disregard for) the regulatory environment. I’m in NYC and honestly can’t figure out how to legally hire a studio assistant for a few hours a week without being at risk for any of a number of lawsuit vectors. So I just coil my own cables. And I don’t mentor people who want to learn some…

The way to protect workers is to shift the burden of health care and other costly benefits onto the government, supported by taxes. Then there is no risk to hiring a new employee beyond the wages you pay them. The US public does not want this, though, and the war of words over universal health care has led to incredibly deep entrenchment on the side of those opposed. All this despite the mountain of evidence from oth…

> Then there is no risk to hiring a new employee beyond the wages you pay them.

but you must not forget the additional administrative/accounting overhead, the risk from the wide variety of lawsuits one is vulnerable to as an employer, the risks of employee injury on the job, and costs associated with the possibility of laying off employees in the future. surely there are more costs than just wages.

Re: California passes bill that classifies gig economy workers as employees

#416

So... reincorporate subsidiary in Micronesia and ignore the laws from there?

A car service app that the public uses has a large surface for regulatory enforcement. When NYC wants to catch illegal car service activity they have police or the taxi commission post people at the airport.

Incorporation somewhere without rules only works if the space your enterprise operates in is outside the reach of the gov't as well.

Re: California passes bill that classifies gig economy workers as employees

#417

All these people making Uber money on the side ... the whole thing was possible in part due to the low friction in (and also complete disregard for) the regulatory environment. I’m in NYC and honestly can’t figure out how to legally hire a studio assistant for a few hours a week without being at risk for any of a number of lawsuit vectors. So I just coil my own cables. And I don’t mentor people who want to learn some…

The way to protect workers is to shift the burden of health care and other costly benefits onto the government, supported by taxes. Then there is no risk to hiring a new employee beyond the wages you pay them. The US public does not want this, though, and the war of words over universal health care has led to incredibly deep entrenchment on the side of those opposed. All this despite the mountain of evidence from oth…

> The US public does not want this

A majority does, in fact, want this.

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/10/03/most-contin...

Re: California passes bill that classifies gig economy workers as employees

#418

All these people making Uber money on the side ... the whole thing was possible in part due to the low friction in (and also complete disregard for) the regulatory environment. I’m in NYC and honestly can’t figure out how to legally hire a studio assistant for a few hours a week without being at risk for any of a number of lawsuit vectors. So I just coil my own cables. And I don’t mentor people who want to learn some…

The way to protect workers is to shift the burden of health care and other costly benefits onto the government, supported by taxes. Then there is no risk to hiring a new employee beyond the wages you pay them. The US public does not want this, though, and the war of words over universal health care has led to incredibly deep entrenchment on the side of those opposed. All this despite the mountain of evidence from oth…

In America, you have to work until you die. The major thing the gig economy takes from people is health care. It's insanely expensive, and the Affordable Care Act is a terrible shamble of broken policy. I spent time outside of the US and came back to find health care worse than when I left it:

https://fightthefuture.org/article/returning-to-america-and-...

I have a friend who has been fighting brain cancer for over a year. The small company he was working for let him go (although they wouldn't admit it; it was likely over his condition) and his wife has to constant fight her own company's insurance company/policy to get treatments covered (and she is a lawyer; who literally works for a law firm doing mostly corporate liability cases).

In any EU country, you get a terminal illness, you can take time off and live your life. Will you get the same level of treatment as you would in the US? Who cares. You get treatment, and you can spent time with the people you love and appreciate things until you get better or your friends say goodbye. In America, if you do not have a spouse, you just have to keep working until you can't any more .. and then you die.

Re: California passes bill that classifies gig economy workers as employees

#419

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The way to protect workers is to shift the burden of health care and other costly benefits onto the government, supported by taxes. Then there is no risk to hiring a new employee beyond the wages you pay them. The US public does not want this, though, and the war of words over universal health care has led to incredibly deep entrenchment on the side of those opposed. All this despite the mountain of evidence from oth…

I can think of several countries with universal healthcare where hiring is still complicated to say the least. Not arguing it would still help, though!

Welcome to Europe.

Re: California passes bill that classifies gig economy workers as employees

#420

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The way to protect workers is to shift the burden of health care and other costly benefits onto the government, supported by taxes. Then there is no risk to hiring a new employee beyond the wages you pay them. The US public does not want this, though, and the war of words over universal health care has led to incredibly deep entrenchment on the side of those opposed. All this despite the mountain of evidence from oth…

In America, you have to work until you die. The major thing the gig economy takes from people is health care. It's insanely expensive, and the Affordable Care Act is a terrible shamble of broken policy. I spent time outside of the US and came back to find health care worse than when I left it: https://fightthefuture.org/article/returning-to-america-and-... I have a friend who has been fighting brain cancer for over a…

Based on the very large revenue from foreign patients who come to America to get cancer treatment on their own dime, those patients and their families care about getting the best treatment.
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