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Green card seekers must leave U.S. to apply, Trump administration says

nytimes.com

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Re: Green card seekers must leave U.S. to apply, Trump administration says

#401

Post by ciconia »

I think it is hard for citizens to understand how precarious it feels to be an immigrant in the present political climate in the US and Europe. I'm a permanent resident in France, I'm white, I have a EU passport, I have a job, I'm OK. But, my naturalization request has already been denied twice, because I couldn't provide some arbitrary document the government demands, and they keep changing the rules, just for the fun of it or so it seems, it's quite insulting.

I really feel for immigrants that are less fortunate than me. we all just want to have dignity, find a job (anyway the low-paying jobs are done by immigrants) and provide for our kids. What's wrong with that? How is this taking advantage of our host country?

Frankly, the present discourse around African/Arab immigration seems to me to resemble a lot the kind of rhetoric around the millions of Jewish Russian immigrants who fled pogroms to Poland and western Europe a 120 years ago. I find the similarities quite striking. The blatant racism, the conspiracy theories, the fascist propaganda, all in order to whitewash (pun intended) a corrupt regime of thieves and sycophants. Absolutely disgusting!

Re: Green card seekers must leave U.S. to apply, Trump administration says

#402

Post by querulous »

ViktorRay wrote: post #370

This is going to worsen healthcare in the United States. Many critical roles are filled with doctors who are here on visas because there simply aren’t American graduates who want those jobs. I’m talking about jobs being doctors in hospitals and towns and cities that are not the most desirable. Many of those doctors filling these positions today are immigrants who are on visas. They want to get green cards and stay he…

the number of doctors on j1 extensions the us is going to lose over this is going to seriously impact us healthcare. it's also not uncommon for doctors to practice on an o1 and they'll be impacted also

Re: Green card seekers must leave U.S. to apply, Trump administration says

#403

Post by tybstar »

pixelatedindex wrote: post #359
esalman wrote: post #280

I received my green card in 2023 and I have mixed emotions. On one hand, I'm so relieved that I have been able to dodge everything that the administration has been throwing at immigrant (legal and illegal alike), trying to see what sticks, like mass deportations, border wall expansion, visa restrictions, asylum crackdown, H-1B cuts, and chain Migration Ban. On the other hand, we cannot apply for citizenship for 3 mor…

> and paid over $100,000 in taxes last year alone Genuinely curious, what does taxes have to do with it? Everyone pays taxes, legal or illegal in some form. I don’t think paying your dues should make you more likely to get through the pipeline. After all, you paid those taxes because you made good money, which is what people come here for.

A lot of the anti-immigrant rhetoric involves some version of the lie that immigrants don't pay taxes.

Re: Green card seekers must leave U.S. to apply, Trump administration says

#404

Post by happytoexplain »

Fraterkes wrote: post #388
ern wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know this is going to. be contentious, but US mainstream discourse seems to have completely eliminated the distinction between illegal and legal immigration, in the last 10 years. Everyone seems to be a "migrant".

Nearly half of the workforce of crop farmworkers in the US is made up of "illegal" immigrants. The US food-supply relying on those people has meant that, in practice, immigration law enforcement is deliberately selective and self-serving. So, the idea of illegal immigration as a vice worth cracking down on and punishing has not been consistently applied by the people publicly condemning it (like this current administ…

"The people"? Are you sure you're not committing the common sin of conflating vocal people with most people? For example, I publicly condemn illegal immigration, regardless of which industry said immigrants are propping up, while at the same time recognizing that such industries need to be carefully extricated from reliance on illegal immigrants and also that the management of immigration and the definition of illegal immigration needs to be fixed.

Re: Green card seekers must leave U.S. to apply, Trump administration says

#405

Post by ViktorRay »

rayiner wrote: post #84
zaptheimpaler wrote: post #81

This is probably for the best in the long term. They've added enough friction, insanity and disdain for foreigners that no sane person will immigrate and we can start to build stronger industries and trade relationships outside the US.

Isn’t it better for the smart people in India to stay there and make India richer, instead of coming to the U.S. to make billionaires here richer? These countries absolutely suffer from the brain drain.

The problem with this thinking is assuming that countries are equivalent in terms of opportunity and life.

India does not have the same opportunities that America does to have a good and successful life. This isn’t just due to the country being relatively poor but due to structural issues along with corruption. Then there are other issues too. Environmental issues. Too many issues to list.

It’s disingenuous to suggest that a families or individuals should stay behind to change this. Also isnt it a loss for everyone? If smart people come to America and take advantage of opportunities and accomplish things that help many people what good is it to say no to this. That they must stay in the home country and inevitably not accomplish as much due to all these issues. Even if Elon Musk and Jensen Huang had stayed in their home countries they certainly could not have accomplished the same amount they did in America. Both South Africa and Taiwan in that period lacked the opportunities.

Also what is the rationale behind an American saying to people not to come to America and improve it but to stay back? Individual Indians aren’t any different from individual Americans beyond their accent. The children of these immigrants are indistinguishable from Americans who have been here for generations (aside from skin color). I really don’t understand why Americans wouldn’t want the brain gain from having smart people come here. Also if a surgeon is operating on you would you care what skin color or accent they had? Doesn’t make sense to me.

Re: Green card seekers must leave U.S. to apply, Trump administration says

#406

Post by happytoexplain »

SecretDreams wrote: post #371
jfengel wrote: post #158

I hear "I'm not anti immigrant, I'm anti illegal immigrant" a lot. To which there is an easy solution: increase the number of legal immigrants we allow. Instead we're doing exactly the opposite, cutting down on legal immigration as well. Making it hard for me to believe that it was ever about illegal immigration at all.

They only want a certain type of immigrants. I know some that go through the process easy breezy and others that absolutely suffer. It is largely dictated by country of origin, outside of the normal checkboxes.

Everybody across the world only wants a certain type of immigrant. The salient difference is whether the definition of "certain type" is petty or not (e.g. based on skin color vs based on qualifications).

Re: Green card seekers must leave U.S. to apply, Trump administration says

#407

Post by tegiddrone »

My H1B coworker has paid $180k more in taxes than I have. We are the same age. He has fewer years working in USA than I have as a citizen. We calculated this by the data exposed by the mySocialSecurity website.

I get to vote and he does not.

Edit: s/green card/H1B/

Re: Green card seekers must leave U.S. to apply, Trump administration says

#408

Post by SomaticPirate »

Not to speak on the anguish that this would undoubtedly cause but economically? This is like shooting yourself in the kneecap. America doesn’t nearly have the social security net of European countries and ours is already overburdened. Without younger, immigrant workers paying into our social security net the US govt will either need to print money (double digit inflation) or start raiding the evil tech bros RSUs for Medicare money.

Being a natvist is an expensive proposition. Expect your retirement to decrease in real value and struggle to find acceptable healthcare as you age (healthcare in the US is increasingly staffed by immigrants, especially nursing).

Re: Green card seekers must leave U.S. to apply, Trump administration says

#409

Post by [deleted] »

didgetmaster wrote: post #325

The whole immigration argument basically boils down to two schools of thought. 1) Those who believe that every human born on this planet has a basic right to move to and live in, any country that they want. 2) Those who believe that the people who are currently citizens of countries around the world, have the right to set strict restrictions on who is allowed to move there. These two schools are fundamentally at odds…

[deleted]

Re: Green card seekers must leave U.S. to apply, Trump administration says

#410

Post by tty456 »

jfengel wrote: post #158

I hear "I'm not anti immigrant, I'm anti illegal immigrant" a lot. To which there is an easy solution: increase the number of legal immigrants we allow. Instead we're doing exactly the opposite, cutting down on legal immigration as well. Making it hard for me to believe that it was ever about illegal immigration at all.

The "anti illegal immigrant" crowd ignores, or more likely supports, the systemic racism built into the current immigration system put in place by racist lawmakers throughout the country.

This new policy is no different and is a trap to kick out and never accept back more non-white immigrants.

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