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AI got the blame for the Iran school bombing. The truth is more worrying

theguardian.com

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Re: AI got the blame for the Iran school bombing. The truth is more worrying

#401

Post by dlubarov »

epolanski wrote: post #394
dlubarov wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Benjamin Netanyahu on record. And there's plenty of such quotes. If there are "plenty" of quotes like this, can you identify just one that we know he actually said? (Not the "thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state" quote, which is unverified and denied by him [1].) In any case, actions speak louder than words. If we look past Wikipedians' spin and look the substance of what Israel actually did, they once f…

[flagged]

Correcting misinformation is “shilling”? What does my work have to do with anything?

Your claim was that Netanyahu was "on record" with "plenty" of quotes. If that's true, surely it must be very easy to identify two or three specific quotes that he definitely said? Your link doesn't do that. The first answer doesn't quote Netanyahu. The second says "well he didn't deny the unverified quote", which is obviously false/outdated per my link above.

In any case, is there some particular action Netanyahu took to "support Hamas" that you disagree with? Do you think Israel should have blocked the Qatari aid funds, which were ostensibly necessary to keep basic civil services running and prevent societal collapse?

Re: AI got the blame for the Iran school bombing. The truth is more worrying

#402

Post by lovich »

stickfigure wrote: post #172
lovich wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I refuse to believe anyone in the decision chain would move forward if they believed kids were going to be killed. If you do - how can you? Why would they? Because they’re openly callous and contemptful of anyone they don’t consider a heritage American? Because the admin has already abused children to lure out parents in their anti immigrant push? And that’s before getting into the Epstein file allegations and if h…

Nobody deliberately produces propaganda for their enemies. The people involved may be evil and stupid, but nobody is that evil and stupid.

I find your worldview naive.

You have evidence in front of you on a weekly basis of these people being that evil and that stupid, and we’re coming up on 2 years of that playing out.

Re: AI got the blame for the Iran school bombing. The truth is more worrying

#403

Post by OrangePilled »

epolanski wrote: post #394
dlubarov wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Benjamin Netanyahu on record. And there's plenty of such quotes. If there are "plenty" of quotes like this, can you identify just one that we know he actually said? (Not the "thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state" quote, which is unverified and denied by him [1].) In any case, actions speak louder than words. If we look past Wikipedians' spin and look the substance of what Israel actually did, they once f…

[flagged]

The problem is that the language you're using—"propped up Hamas"—obscures the fact that for the bulk of the time when Israel was directly supporting Sheikh Ahmed Yassin's efforts, "Hamas" technically didn't exist. Yes, those early contributions obviously facilitated its emergence, but this is probably why people are disagreeing with you.

On the other hand, that doesn't belie the argument that Israel/Netanyahu's tactics since 1989 (e.g. leveraging Qatari aid) have ulterior motives assigned.

This CNN article touches well on the reasoning behind Netanyahu's approval for the Qatari aid: https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/11/middleeast/qatar-hamas-funds-...

Your original point about Hamas being used as a proxy for Iran was solid. It's a pity that it's since descended into an argument about a secondary remark. But the support that Hamas gets from Iran versus the support than Hamas gets from Qatar (with Israeli/American approval) shouldn't be conflated.

https://jstribune.com/levitt-the-hamas-iran-relationship/

https://www.spiegel.de/international/world/nato-partner-and-...

Re: AI got the blame for the Iran school bombing. The truth is more worrying

#404

Post by orwin »

Jensson wrote: post #391
orwin wrote: post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Houthis open adversaries, Saudi, are aware that they are not really Iranian proxies [0]. Sunnis in Lebanon are Persian Shi'a 'proxy' only since their leadership was assassinated during negotiations in 2024 (also by this very liberal definition of 'proxy', eastern Iranian clans are US/Israel proxies, and killed more Iranians than Hamas killed Israelis, so I'm not sure we really want to get into it). The only proxy Ira…

Iran gives missiles to the houtis, houtis then use those to fire at American ships. Its the same kind of proxy war as Ukrain, and people call that a proxy.

Thank you, that's my point. If you think Houtis are a proxy, then you think Ukraine is a proxy for the US, as Houtis have to promise concessions to Iran in exchange for armaments. Better yet, they choose their target without iranian input, so they are even less of a proxy than Ukraine who has been forbidden by the US to use the weapons they were given outside of their borders.

If you think Hezbollah are an Iranian proxy, then Israel is an US proxy, and Hamas is a Qatar/Likud proxy (won't be the first time the far right pay agitators to kill their own citizen to stay/be in power, just look at Italy).

Re: AI got the blame for the Iran school bombing. The truth is more worrying

#405

Post by alsetmusic »

Jensson wrote: post #361
lejalv wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Time for a massive boycott to all US-American products? Or what else will stop the thugs?

Nobody will stop USA as long as they fight evil regimes.

> Nobody will stop USA as long as they fight evil regimes.

At what point will the USA fight the evil genociding Israeli state?

Re: AI got the blame for the Iran school bombing. The truth is more worrying

#406

Post by tovej »

shykes wrote: post #396
tovej wrote: post #373

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Least credible? Fringe? Forensic Architecture is a very respected source that has done in-depth technical analysis of many, many accidents and incidents, e.g. the Beirut port explosion. Articles from Forensic Architecture are often featured on HN. It received the Peabody award in 2021. It received the Right Livelihood award in 2024. It is a research unit under the university of London. Its reports have been used as e…

You haven't addressed the fact that the overwhelming OSINT consensus contradicts their claim, making it fringe by definition. I am very familiar with FA, and with that particular paper. That's the thing with echo chambers: the people inside of it are all repeating the same exact talking points, drawing from the same narrow set of "approved" sources. And in the case of Al-ahli, the set is very, very narrow, so it gets…

You have not presented any evidence, you're just claiming there is a consensus, and that it's foolproof. Please stop the posturing and produce something. As it is your post contains zero information content.

Afaik, the cause of the explosion has not been conclusively shown by anyone, and it is still contested. But FA has presented the most detailed analysis of all.

You're also painting with vey broad strokes, making claims about me picking from a narrow set of sources. Based on what? Vibes? Why don't you throw out some more accusations while you're at it.

If you're familiar with FA, then your claim that they are not credible is very strange indeed. Because they are very thorough in their analysis, and known for it. It seems you have some very strong ideological reasons not to like the conclusions they come to.

Re: AI got the blame for the Iran school bombing. The truth is more worrying

#407

Post by anigbrowl »

stickfigure wrote: post #399
anigbrowl wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No it isn't. You're assuming perfect information, when the reality is nowhere near as clear. I certainly believe that Iran killed a lot of protesters recently. Undoubtedly some of them were innocent. Some others were collaborators; Israel is well known to be engaged in a shadow war with Iran and to have infiltrated a large number of people within the Iranian security apparatus. I'm thus extremely skeptical of any spe…

You're giving the regime far more of the benefit of the doubt than they deserve. Their crimes are well documented. Aside from that, the risk of accidentally bombing a school is also an unknown quantity. So we're looking at "risk of leaving the regime in place" vs "risk of accidentally bombing kids". Feels plenty trolly-ish to me. No matter how inept or corrupt the process, the fact is some bombs fell out of the sky a…

Too bad the same wouldn't happen in DC, a far more murderous regime.

Re: AI got the blame for the Iran school bombing. The truth is more worrying

#408

Post by orochimaaru »

stickfigure wrote: post #400
orochimaaru wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Still not worth the lives of children

What about 100 thousand dead protesters? A million? I'm curious to know what you consider a reasonable exchange rate.

I don’t have an exchange rate when it comes to dealing with lives of children. That’s a reprehensible statement.

Re: AI got the blame for the Iran school bombing. The truth is more worrying

#409

Post by shykes »

tovej wrote: post #406
shykes wrote: post #396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You haven't addressed the fact that the overwhelming OSINT consensus contradicts their claim, making it fringe by definition. I am very familiar with FA, and with that particular paper. That's the thing with echo chambers: the people inside of it are all repeating the same exact talking points, drawing from the same narrow set of "approved" sources. And in the case of Al-ahli, the set is very, very narrow, so it gets…

You have not presented any evidence, you're just claiming there is a consensus, and that it's foolproof. Please stop the posturing and produce something. As it is your post contains zero information content. Afaik, the cause of the explosion has not been conclusively shown by anyone, and it is still contested. But FA has presented the most detailed analysis of all. You're also painting with vey broad strokes, making…

> You have not presented any evidence, you're just claiming there is a consensus

- US government (Biden administration): https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/us-has-high-confid...

- Canadian government: https://www.canada.ca/en/department-national-defence/news/20...

- French government: https://apnews.com/article/israel-hamas-war-france-intellige...

- IDF: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Y70TjUKVYk

- Human Rights Watch: https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/11/26/gaza-findings-october-17...

- Wall Street Journal: https://www.wsj.com/video/video-analysis-shows-gaza-hospital...

- Bellingcat: https://www.bellingcat.com/news/2023/10/18/identifying-possi...

> making claims about me picking from a narrow set of sources. Based on what?

Based on the fact that you only provided one source? I did find two more sources that corroborate your claim that Israel is responsible: Hamas and Palestinian Islamic Jihad...

> Because they are very thorough in their analysis, and known for it. It seems you have some very strong ideological reasons not to like the conclusions they come to.

And what conclusions would that be?

Re: AI got the blame for the Iran school bombing. The truth is more worrying

#410

Post by fud101 »

niam wrote: post #13
ognav wrote: post #4

The Guardian carrying water for the AI industry. The distinction between Maven and Claude is futile. We get that Maven is Palantir, but it integrates Claude: https://www.reuters.com/technology/palantir-faces-challenge-... Going into a generic rant about anti-AI people after missing sources and believing the Department of War is just extremely poor journalism from the newspaper that destroyed evidence after a command…

The article you're responding to is making specific operational claims about Claude's (basically non-) relevance. I'd be interested to hear if you're directionally correct, but forgive me if I need more details than "but it integrates Claude".

Directionally correct is the other kind of emdash.
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