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Vibe code is legacy code

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Re: Vibe code is legacy code

#401

Post by CharlieDigital »

bagacrap wrote: post #399
CharlieDigital wrote: post #67

A story about a non-technical friend: friend vibe coded a SaaS last year and started generating revenue with almost no marketing; all word of mouth and inbound in a niche industry. Used Replit and Supabase to build the thing; I am still really impressed by what he was able to do given how complex the app ended up becoming as he interacted with customers. What I think happened: there are two incumbents in this space t…

Doesn't sound like it was worth it to the paying customers/guinea pigs whose data became vulnerable bc your friend said "security? Lol". But I guess that's true of normie-coded startups as well.

The customers know he was hacked because the hacker sent an email to everyone on the customer list. Yet none of the customers left and he's only grown the customer base since then.

I think that tells you something: they have a real, painful, and costly problem to solve that he solves for them to a T.

> ...normie-coded startups

Having been in the startup space for the last 20 years spanning bootstrapped companies to startups that raised $8m seed rounds to startups that raised a $100m C round, I've learned that there's only one thing that matters: solving valuable problems and getting that in front of customers.

You can be as technically pristine as you want and live in an ivory tower, but that rarely if ever leads to a successful entrepreneurial endeavor.

Re: Vibe code is legacy code

#402

Post by marstall »

it's not such a binary. we all of us, software developers, are using AI every day now. It's one of our tools and we're staying present for at, sensing its energy. we let it run wild and get bored watching it work. Whatever it does is miraculous, even if it will take as long to fit it into your big project as it would have taken to write it on your own. and then you'd have a better understanding of your tools, your product, maybe even your customer.

we give it bits and pieces one after another and marvel at what its done. It nags at us that we can't reason about the outcome, but use it anyway. It's no problem. Or it is sometimes. We don't know what's going to happen. We switch tooling completely, then again. This shit is miraculous. Clock in.

Re: Vibe code is legacy code

#403

Post by iluvlawyering »

pydry wrote: post #382
zerkten wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> It was crazy just how fast it was exploited. People underestimate the speed, but also the number of pivots that advanced attackers will make. Sure, these kinds of problems are easy to exploit, but with major organizations that employ reasonable defenses, the attackers will pivot through 50+ exploits/machines/layers to get to the target(s). This can take place over weeks or months.

It still doesn't make sense that advanced attackers would go to those lengths in order to... refund the customers.

Maybe guy's running the chatbot as customer service and user turned hacker to get his money back.

Re: Vibe code is legacy code

#404

Post by encom »

1718627440 wrote: post #397
encom wrote: post #342

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's an amusing thing to try on anything with SSH exposed. These log files go back a month. # zcat -f /var/log/auth.log* | awk '/sshd/ && /Invalid user/ && $6 != "from" {print $6}' | sort | uniq -c | sort -bnr | head -n 30 5190 #redacted: my domain name 3063 admin 1891 #redacted: another domain name 931 user 724 ubuntu 287 test 268 solv 206 odoo15 200 solana 197 sol 184 ubnt 173 wialon 170 Antminer 169 guest 168 od…

I'm surprised there is no root there? In my experience this is by far the most common.

I'm almost certain SSH does not allow root login by default.

Re: Vibe code is legacy code

#405

Post by WJW »

guappa wrote: post #309
ben-schaaf wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe more accurately: it's still theft if the door was left open.

But the insurance won't refund you.

A judge will still find you guilty if you try "but the door was unlocked so anything inside was fair game to take".

Re: Vibe code is legacy code

#406

Post by imcritic »

I call bullshit on this article and most of its arguments. The article was written out of fear felt as programmers' gate keeping falls apart and programming becomes generally more available to the broader auditory.

A quote from the article:

> Programming is fundamentally theory building, not producing lines of code. We know this.

Well, then you should understand that the "vibe coder" is someone with the idea for the code and during the vibe code session they build the theory for the program. Coding is less important than the idea behind the code.

So what the resulting code is "one use" and "legacy" or whatever if it does the job? If the vibe coder has saved their prompts - it could be later reproduced, improved and extended just the same way!

Re: Vibe code is legacy code

#407

Post by SecretDreams »

therein wrote: post #204
SecretDreams wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Breaking things is fun. Effectively stealing money (the refunds) is highly illegal, immoral, and malicious. Who knows who did it, but that aspect is just dickhead territory.

I wouldn't call that stealing. It is a forced refund. A hacker could even justify it to himself that these people were unknowingly paying for a shitty product that was built like Swiss cheese, time to give them a refund. Another plausible one is "this guy shouldn't be allowed to run a website, I can't believe he made money for it, it is going back". I am not saying it is the most likely case or even ethically justifi…

> I wouldn't call that stealing. It is a forced refund.

Respectfully, what the hell are you talking about?

Imagine you work 40 hours making an app and I pay you for those 40 hours. A third party comes in and says, I'm forcing a refund here - you lose the money you made, but you get the app you made.

How do you feel about this forced refund?

Re: Vibe code is legacy code

#408

Post by jonplackett »

imcritic wrote: post #406

I call bullshit on this article and most of its arguments. The article was written out of fear felt as programmers' gate keeping falls apart and programming becomes generally more available to the broader auditory. A quote from the article: > Programming is fundamentally theory building, not producing lines of code. We know this. Well, then you should understand that the "vibe coder" is someone with the idea for the…

The article is also just an ad for their product

Re: Vibe code is legacy code

#409

Post by SecretDreams »

_Algernon_ wrote: post #340
motorest wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I wouldn't call that stealing. It is a forced refund. If someone took money out of your pocket would you call it stealing? What if they gave it to someone else, like a past employer or your parents or a humanitarian organization? By the way, you should check a dictionary. The definition of "stealing" is literally taking something away without permission.

Being in the possession of a password or key implies having permission to use that key. When generating a key you give everyone with access to that key the permission to use it to perform actions on your account. Protect your keys.

> Being in the possession of a password or key implies having permission to use that key

So if I get your house key I can use your bathroom?

Seriously, what hill are you trying to die on here?

Re: Vibe code is legacy code

#410

Post by cadr »

bdangubic wrote: post #138

I have been SWE for almost three decades now - have read all the comments in this post and almost every negative comment about vibe coding holds true about almost every single ‘human-coded’ codebase I’ve ever seen ( some notable exceptions of course :) )

When you say "almost" - could you say something about the codebases you saw where this doesn't apply? I'd love to hear about the best codebase you were SWE for and what we could learn from it.
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