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GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

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Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#401

Post by eru »

gscott wrote: post #318
raldi wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then wouldn’t the government want to subsidize it?

Elon Musk suggested it. The fast food Industry has ppl addicted along with the lack of health education in schools.

> [...] along with the lack of health education in schools.

I don't think that's too much of a factor?

I mean, check how much (or rather how little) people learn of the stuff that _is_ covered in school. Tweaking the curriculum would just mean that instead of not paying attention in algebra, students would not pay attention in 'health education class'.

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#402

Post by tonyhart7 »

PeterStuer wrote: post #377
hiAndrewQuinn wrote: post #23

So... There's a miracle drug powerful enough to robustly lower people's all cause mortality, but since health insurance and life insurance are industries with vastly different time preferences, this is not a good thing for the life insurers because people just keep getting off the magic longevity drug and screwing up their predictions. Because, admittedly, it kind of sucks in the moment to be on. And I'm guessing jus…

Pharmaceuticals generally do not drop in price while they are under patent. They will lobby like crazy to get on the approved 3rd party payment schemes though as that makes it "affordable" to more as then everybody pays regardless of wether you use or not. And a treatement that you have to continue forever or fall back? Pure gold! Insurers certaily don't mind you living longer. More payments, less payouts. They just…

I think this is US only problem

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#403

Post by eru »

paulpauper wrote: post #259
Jach wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think GLP-1s are particularly expensive, so my top preference would be to just see them easily available. While not quite the same, it's a win that Rogaine/Minoxidil were once prescription-only but for a long time now can be bought at any grocery store and taken to the self-checkout. Still, I think the subsidy approach has been done for smoking problems via nicotine products before, and e.g. nicotine gum cost…

yeah this is true. When people say that obesity is worse than smoking, I'm like "Have you looked at the actual stats on this?"

Smoking is pretty good for pension systems.

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#404

Post by stavros »

Auracle wrote: post #362
mattmanser wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's often side effects, including nausea, diarrhea, headaches, bloating, discomfort, etc. As far as I can tell from forums, it's not like 5% have the side effects, it's like 80-90%. But for the first time in decades, I felt full. I didn't want to finish a meal, it was too much. My body regulated my food intake in what felt like a natural way. I hadn't even realized my body had somehow lost that fundamental mechan…

I’m sorry, but as one of the rare (decently) fit & nondiabetic people that have taken these drugs I’m going to call out your comment a bit. While I have no doubt that obese people have gradually made appetite control harder for themselves, the full feeling you get on GLP meds is in no way the way us normal-weight people feel. I too, could easy eat a whole bag of doritos after some pizza and then decide I want ice cre…

Yeah but right now we're just arguing about how strong each person's feeling of "I could eat more" is.

Personally, I really like how, on the medication, it's easy to say "nah, I'd better not". Off the medication, it's impossible, as I have to eat whatever is in front of me, or I won't stop thinking about it.

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#405

Post by const_cast »

firesteelrain wrote: post #396
const_cast wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No offense, but that's not particularly impressive and you're bragging about your discipline a bit prematurely. It's highly likely in the next ten years you will regain most of the weight back. I've known many, many, people to lose weight via extreme diets such as keto. Such diets are unsustainable for almost everyone. It will work for a year or two, but inevitably, they will falter. Often it only takes a very small…

My partner on this medicine over a period of two years went from 300 to 197. They have not gained it back after stopping. Their diabetes was reversed and is now in prediabetes. They still has to take Metformin. In order for me to gain all that weight back, I would have to eat a ton of calories per day and completely stop moving/exercise. It’s been nearly a year since I started losing all that weight and I haven’t sli…

> In order for me to gain all that weight back, I would have to eat a ton of calories per day and completely stop moving/exercise.

Yes, this is what usually happens. You've spent far, far more time with those calories than without.

> It’s been nearly a year

Okay, that's not a very long time is my point. It's much too early to think it's over.

I'm not saying that it's not possible to get off GLP-1s and maintain a good lifestyle. I'm saying that I don't think it's a moral failing or a lack of... sigh... "discipline" if people need to be on these drugs for life. Frankly, I think it's very rich that a baby skinny person is lecturing us on discipline. You've been doing this for less than a year. Discipline means sticking to habits for a long period of time, even when times are tough. I would not classify less than a year as that.

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#406

Post by _cenw »

sroussey wrote: post #221
randallsquared wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who is mildly needle-phobic, I'll agree it's no big deal, but you definitely can feel it, and if you hit a blood vessel by accident, there's a (mostly painless) bump and 2-3 week bruise at the injection site, which might be a major issue for some.

Be sure to pull back on the plunger and ensure there the needle is not in a blood vessel (pulling back will draw blood into the thing and you will see). You do not want the drug meant to subcutaneous to go into the blood steam. This is true for GPL-1s (all peptides for that matter), as well as insulin, and definitely mRNA vaccines.

Absolutely do not do this.

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#407

Post by _cenw »

abruzzi wrote: post #302
sroussey wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Be sure to pull back on the plunger and ensure there the needle is not in a blood vessel (pulling back will draw blood into the thing and you will see). You do not want the drug meant to subcutaneous to go into the blood steam. This is true for GPL-1s (all peptides for that matter), as well as insulin, and definitely mRNA vaccines.

Mounjaro uses a single use fully autometed injector--clean your skin, remove the cap, press the injector against your skin, then press a button. A springloaded needle penetrates you skin and a spring loaded plunger injects the medicine. You have no way to pull backthe plunger to see if you are in a vein/artery. I've never used Ozempic, but my understanding was it used a device similar to insulin pens--dial you dosage…

Mounjaro uses very different designs across the world. The UK has an included needle; here in Germany you need to get them yourself, and neither is an auto-injector.

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#408

Post by A_D_E_P_T »

eru wrote: post #390
A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Life insurance, in the past, was frequently illegal. I'd argue that it should be illegal again, as a moral hazard (directly contributing to countless murders and other schemes) and as a particularly morbid form of gambling.

> (directly contributing to countless murders and other schemes) Do you have any data on how much of a problem that is?

In the US, a reasonable estimate is dozens of murders per year. I don't know if we can do any better without running a study: There's no good data easily available; the murder clearance rate in the US is now quite low; most insurance killings are, of course, staged to look like accidents.

But it's enough of a problem that there are quite a lot of legal journal articles about it, e.g.: https://scholarship.law.campbell.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?art...

Life insurance has killed a lot of people. People who would otherwise be alive but for the existence of payouts upon their deaths.

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#409

Post by firesteelrain »

const_cast wrote: post #405
firesteelrain wrote: post #396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My partner on this medicine over a period of two years went from 300 to 197. They have not gained it back after stopping. Their diabetes was reversed and is now in prediabetes. They still has to take Metformin. In order for me to gain all that weight back, I would have to eat a ton of calories per day and completely stop moving/exercise. It’s been nearly a year since I started losing all that weight and I haven’t sli…

> In order for me to gain all that weight back, I would have to eat a ton of calories per day and completely stop moving/exercise. Yes, this is what usually happens. You've spent far, far more time with those calories than without. > It’s been nearly a year Okay, that's not a very long time is my point. It's much too early to think it's over. I'm not saying that it's not possible to get off GLP-1s and maintain a good…

Okay will report back in one year.

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#410

Post by ReverseCold »

blindriver wrote: post #333

The last thing I will ever give a rats ass about is insurance companies. They are the scourge of this earth but they have used legislation to embed themselves in our every day lives. I live in California and have no claims ever. My home insurance has doubled in 4 years to almost $4000 a year. My car insurance is about $2800/yr. So I hope insurance companies break. Like Danerys said in Gamr of Thrones, I hope someone…

> I live in California

Car insurance companies in CA actually lose money on the state, if that makes you feel better: https://money.com/car-insurance-policies-problems-california...

There are laws that prevent them from charging enough to even break-even on the policies.

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