Curtis Yarvin's Plot Against America • Hacker News Board

Re: Curtis Yarvin's Plot Against America

#401

Post by queenkjuul » Thu, Jun 05, 2025, 7:05 PM UTC

soulofmischief wrote: post #399

queenkjuul wrote: post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes the ever impending Chinese financial collapse I've been reading about since 2017 Any day now, right?

If you're incapable of recognizing the signs of an empire's collapse, slow as it may be initially, then you're trading a feeling of superiority in the present for being totally blindsided in the future when suddenly things accelerate and the world's governments begin to struggle under increasingly untenable energy and resource demands in the name of meeting quarterly growth quotas. The fact is that the signs are ther…

I was referring specifically to "reports of bank closures" that were they actually happening with such frequency and scale as has been reported on since 2017 or so, would surely have already caused a financial collapse.

Any day now though, surely.

Re: Curtis Yarvin's Plot Against America

#402

Post by youngtaff » Thu, Jun 05, 2025, 7:05 PM UTC

A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #169

youngtaff wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In some places, things are now getting extremely acute: https://www.neilobrien.co.uk/p/the-confluence?r=h8x Neil O’Brien is a right wing anti-immigrant Member of Parliament… as with all politicians what he says should be taken with a pinch of salt

Rather the opposite, I think. To me it seems that the fact that he's an MP makes it all the more interesting. In the UK, as in the US and elsewhere, people across the political spectrum -- and at all levels, from MPs to "Gary the regional sales manager" -- are losing faith in democratic processes. (At least as they're currently implemented.) As an aside, this is exactly what happens in Gibson's Jackpot. > “Who runs i…

Some people are losing faith in the democratic process but that’s largely because they’ve been fed lies by people like Farage and Johnson who’ve promised them things that cannot be delivered

Re: Curtis Yarvin's Plot Against America

#403

Post by tempestn » Thu, Jun 05, 2025, 7:08 PM UTC

Anthony-G wrote: post #393

tempestn wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One thing I'll say for the current era is that it has made a lot of such fiction appear more realistic in hindsight. Another example is the Silo book series, recently adapted to a series on Apple TV. I remember reading those books thinking it was insane than the people would act in such clearly counter-productive ways against their own interests, or that leadership would make up elaborate lies rather than just tellin…

I’ve really enjoyed the TV series (so far). Would you recommend reading the books – either before or after watching future seasons? While watching the first two seasons, I still haven’t understood why the creators of the silos wouldn’t just have told people the truth to avoid the dysfunctionality that results from the cognitive dissonance that the leadership has to maintain. Telling the truth would also preclude the…

It's been a long time since I read the books, but I recall thinking the same as you. And I'm not sure it does entirely make sense, but the world today has made me realize that both people in charge and the population at large can do incredibly damaging things, even directly against their own interests, that appear to make no sense at all. So even if something truly does make no sense, that doesn't make it unrealistic.

That said, I do vaguely recall things making at least somewhat more sense eventually, but I've basically forgotten all the significant plot details (I'm not even 100% certain I finished the series; I may have caught up with the author and then forgotten about it), so I'm basically experiencing it all again for the first time.

Re: Curtis Yarvin's Plot Against America

#404

Post by LAC-Tech » Thu, Jun 05, 2025, 7:23 PM UTC

queenkjuul wrote: post #360

LAC-Tech wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Please stop conflating the Israeli government with Jewish people in general

I don't think that I've done that.

The original assertion was that it would be somehow "ironic" for a jewish person to have ethnocentric/supremacist/nationalist views. I pointed out that it definitely existed in that group.

Re: Curtis Yarvin's Plot Against America

#405

Post by A_D_E_P_T » Thu, Jun 05, 2025, 7:32 PM UTC

youngtaff wrote: post #402

A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rather the opposite, I think. To me it seems that the fact that he's an MP makes it all the more interesting. In the UK, as in the US and elsewhere, people across the political spectrum -- and at all levels, from MPs to "Gary the regional sales manager" -- are losing faith in democratic processes. (At least as they're currently implemented.) As an aside, this is exactly what happens in Gibson's Jackpot. > “Who runs i…

Some people are losing faith in the democratic process but that’s largely because they’ve been fed lies by people like Farage and Johnson who’ve promised them things that cannot be delivered

People these days tend to simply vote against the status quo. Remember "zero seats"? And that's exactly how Trump got elected in the first place -- and then re-elected after a four-year interregnum.

But scratch the surface and all mainstream political parties only offer a continuation or intensification of the status quo.

Re: Curtis Yarvin's Plot Against America

#406

Post by UncleMeat » Thu, Jun 05, 2025, 7:32 PM UTC

absurdo wrote: post #387

UncleMeat wrote: post #343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yarvin’s views spread on hackernews and reddit. The world would be a better place if he was just downvoted to hell initially. I will not participate in something that we already know led to harm. Academics and anti fascist activists should study authoritarians. But in some random web forum the person boosting these ideologies isn’t engaged in any sort of meaningful anti fascism. They are at best a useful rube and at…

The broader issue here seems to be that C.Y. isn’t a random online person venting, in that allegedly the VP endorses his stances [citation needed]. If he was a random kook with a blog nobody knew, we would pay no attention to it. But actively suppressing dissident speech is indeed the slippery slope, and he may get more endorsements as a result. Plus, it just looks bad to silence opposition because it makes the anti-…

I really do not know how "downvotes on hackernews" can be interepreted as "actively suppressing dissident speech."

And no, I do not believe that downvotes on web forums is what led to Trump. Not even a little.

Re: Curtis Yarvin's Plot Against America

#407

Post by thedailymail » Thu, Jun 05, 2025, 7:33 PM UTC

cjbgkagh wrote: post #239

ordinaryradical wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’ve been hearing it’s eminent because most of Chinese history has played out this way and the Chinese world view sees government as dynastic and cyclical as opposed to progressive or something else. It’s plausible because it’s culturally coherent but that does not necessitate it. Communism could have easily been too alien to succeed but Mao made it contextual, so it unified the society instead. The way I look at i…

I’ve been hearing it’s eminent because China is not a democracy, I hear the western perspective. I see revolutions as an alternate elite agitating for change. In my model an effective suppression of an alternative elite is sufficient to prevent revolution. In my model it comes down to which secret police are more effective, the MSS or the CIA. Which is especially relevant here because how much of the ‘Thielverse’ is…

I don't want to be pedantic or prescriptive, but it's "imminent" not "eminent." (The wrong word got introduced upstream in this thread and was taken up by multiple commenters.)

Re: Curtis Yarvin's Plot Against America

#408

Post by jrflowers » Thu, Jun 05, 2025, 7:34 PM UTC

rendang wrote: post #382

jrflowers wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for clarifying that you are using the term “doctrinaire egalitarian leftist” to refer to any individual that does not believe in race science, or more specifically any individual that doesn’t agree with Scott Siskind’s position on race science. I’m personally not super familiar with that label and assumed because of the definitions of those words that it would have some sort of philosophical or ideological…

I've read only perhaps 1% of Siskind's work and don't have a particularly close familiarity with him or opinion on his work, and from that position I'm pointing out that the blog post is not particularly persuasive. It just states that Siskind does not hold to the same presuppositions as the author without making an argument for those presuppositions

> I've read only perhaps 1% of Siskind's work and don't have a particularly close familiarity with him

I see the point you’re trying to make here and I’m sorry I’m just not interested in becoming part of your fandom. I don’t really care how little you feel someone needs to read of Scott’s blog to find race science to be so compelling

Re: Curtis Yarvin's Plot Against America

#409

Post by A_D_E_P_T » Thu, Jun 05, 2025, 7:42 PM UTC

CooCooCaCha wrote: post #395

A_D_E_P_T wrote: post #367

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think that anybody seriously considers the republic of Rome a democracy. Also Athenian and Venetian "democracy" were so wildly different from the current model that it's really not at all the same thing. Hewing more closely to the Athenian model could solve many of the world's problems, but today's oligarchical (at best!) "representatives," having attained power, will not willingly relinquish it.

In that case, you defeated your own argument because if you dismiss historical democracies (which I agree with) then you’re left with modern democracies which haven’t existed long enough to compare with monarachy in terms of resilience. But I also fully acknowledge that invalidates my argument as well. However, I still think the stability of monarchies is overstated. Just because a dynasty lasts for 700 years doesn’t…

Uh, yeah, which is why "democracies are certainly more stable than monarchy" doesn't make any sense.

> modern democracies which haven’t existed long enough to compare with monarachy in terms of resilience.

lol, dude. Western democracy has been been on the wane for a long time now, and it's unironically just about over. The West is either going to continue down its path towards less democracy and plutocrat/oligarch/jurist rule with politics as bread and circuses (very bad, an intensification of what we have right now) -- or make a hard break towards more democracy and prole/populist mob rule (not necessarily a bad thing, unless you're a political extremist like, perhaps ironically, Yarvin himself.)

Polybius saw it all, in his day.

Democracy Oligarchy -->

Re: Curtis Yarvin's Plot Against America

#410

Post by rchaud » Thu, Jun 05, 2025, 7:54 PM UTC

NickC25 wrote: post #381

LAC-Tech wrote: post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is this ironic?

A guy who says that races shouldn't mix, that diversity is bad, etc... happens to be part of a group that historically has been marginalized to some degree nearly every time it tries to integrate itself into a larger society. Sometimes, that same group's not just been marginalized by political word, but by real physical violence. A lot of the "real Americans" in flyover country who rail about "coastal elites" do not…

A lot of these flyover country bigots you speak of have no clue who is part of the Jewish faith and who is not. Most American Jews do not have accents or wear religious garb that would make them stand out, as may have been the case in the world portrayed in Portnoy's Dilemma based in 1920s New York City. Post-WWII, many of those that immigrated to the United States are of European heritage (Polish, Italian, Ukrainian, Russian). In fact, there is a long tradition of efforts (pre-WWII) made by American Jews to force immigrants to hide their Jewish roots and cultural traditions to "help" them avoid the kind of discrimination faced by other European groups (Irish, Italians) by the majority culture. There is an excellent article delving into the history of Jewish perceptions in the US in the magazine Jewish Currents:

https://jewishcurrents.org/our-white-supremacy-problem