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US Copyright Office found AI companies breach copyright. Its boss was fired

theregister.com

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Re: US Copyright Office found AI companies breach copyright. Its boss was fired

#401

Post by johnnyanmac »

rollcat wrote: post #395
johnnyanmac wrote: post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We regulate it like how we did centuries ago that lead to copyright. If we already have rules we enforce it. If no one in power wants to, we put in people who will. In the end this all comes down to needing the people to care enough.

Disney continued to lobby to extend copyright for like half a century. A lot of people did care. What use is regulation if you can just buy it?

>a lot of people did care

As did Disney, apparently.

>what use is regulation if you can just buy it?

I don't like it either, but it still comes down to the same issues. We vote in people who can be bought and don't make a scandal out of it when it happens. The first step to fixing that corruption is to make congress afraid of being ousted if discovered. With today's communication structure, that's easier than ever.

But if the people don't care, we see the obvious Victor.

Re: US Copyright Office found AI companies breach copyright. Its boss was fired

#402

Post by zelphirkalt »

nadermx wrote: post #191
mdhb wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s so fucking obviously illegal when you think about it rationally for more than a few seconds. We aren’t even talking about “fair use” we are talking about how it works in practice which was Meta torrenting pirated books, never paying anyone a cent and straight up stealing the content at scale.

The fact you are even using the word stealing, is telling to your lack of knowledge in this field. Copyright infringement is not stealing[0]. The propaganda of the copyright cartel has gotten to you. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dowling_v._United_States_(1985...

I still feel like the point is useless, because at the end of the day, if some normal person went ahead and did the same thing the tech giant did, they would long be moved to a less comfortable new home, that has high security against breaking in. At the end of the day, the situation now is, that some are more equal than others, and it is unacceptable, yet, due to the mountains of (also unethically acquired) cash they have, they can get away with something a normal person cannot. Even the law might be bent to their will, because if suing them fails, it creates precedence.

If we end up saying it is not illegal, then I demand, that it will not be illegal for everyone. No double standards please. Let us all launder copyrighted material this way, labeling it "AI".

Re: US Copyright Office found AI companies breach copyright. Its boss was fired

#403

Post by temporalparts »

johnnyanmac wrote: post #400
Suppafly wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>You can't just make a collage of copyrighted works and shield yourself from copyright with "expression". And yet collage artists do that all the time.

I'll remind you that all fanart is technically in a gray area of copyright infringement. Legally speaking, companies can take down and charge infringement for anything using their IP thars not under fair use. Collages don't really pass that benchmark. Yoinnking their up and mass producing slop sure is a line to cross, though.

I'm not an expert, but I thought fan art that people try to monetize in some form is explicitly illegal unless it's protected by parody, and any non commercial "violations" of copyright is totally legal. Disney can't stop me from drawing Mickey in the privacy of my own house, just monetizing/getting famous off of them.

Re: US Copyright Office found AI companies breach copyright. Its boss was fired

#404

Post by 93po »

School-Cotton wrote: post #399
93po wrote: post #398

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most is awful, but I'd still say there's just as much good unpaid fiction as paid fiction. Lots of paid fiction is also really, really bad.

Ok, what are some examples of high-quality literary fiction published for free?

i could give examples of both paid and unpaid and have them shot down as "this is crap writing". instead i will simply point out that there is very popular unpaid fiction on the internet, and its popularity is indicative of its quality, even if it doesn't match the standards of a literature PhD for "good writing". so basically go look for the most popular unpaid fiction online and there's your answer. i mean all of this conversationally and kindly, if my tone feels patronizing at all.

Re: US Copyright Office found AI companies breach copyright. Its boss was fired

#405

Post by otterley »

93po wrote: post #404
School-Cotton wrote: post #399

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, what are some examples of high-quality literary fiction published for free?

i could give examples of both paid and unpaid and have them shot down as "this is crap writing". instead i will simply point out that there is very popular unpaid fiction on the internet, and its popularity is indicative of its quality, even if it doesn't match the standards of a literature PhD for "good writing". so basically go look for the most popular unpaid fiction online and there's your answer. i mean all of t…

I think some examples would be helpful that support your argument, along with popularity metrics for these.

Re: US Copyright Office found AI companies breach copyright. Its boss was fired

#406

Post by School-Cotton »

93po wrote: post #404
School-Cotton wrote: post #399

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, what are some examples of high-quality literary fiction published for free?

i could give examples of both paid and unpaid and have them shot down as "this is crap writing". instead i will simply point out that there is very popular unpaid fiction on the internet, and its popularity is indicative of its quality, even if it doesn't match the standards of a literature PhD for "good writing". so basically go look for the most popular unpaid fiction online and there's your answer. i mean all of t…

I specified "literary fiction" intentionally, because I suspected it would be the hardest kind for you to find, and that good genre fiction (sci-fi, mystery, romance, etc.) would be somewhat more likely (though still unlikely) to be available for free. But you seem to have ignored that stipulation and steered us back to just talking about fiction in general, and also using popularity as a benchmark for quality...

> its popularity is indicative of its quality, even if it doesn't match the standards of a literature PhD for "good writing"

This is a false dichotomy. Literature PhDs are not the only people out there who enjoy high-quality literature more than light entertainment, and anyway, you seem to be admitting that there's a type of fiction that doesn't exist unpaid, so isn't this just proving my point correct?

All that said, even if I accept for the sake of argument that the existence of popular free genre fiction would be enough to prove your point (because, in fairness to you, we were originally talking about Harry Potter, which is as genre as it gets)... I went looking, and there are at most a few sporadic examples. A few minutes of research suggest that some books by Cory Doctorow are among the most popular ones. Also, The Martian by Andy Weir used to be freely available, but isn't anymore as far as I can find.

Sorry, but Cory Doctorow and (formerly) Andy Weir represent a pretty small body of work compared to the entire canon of paid novels, so I'm going to have to call BS on your claim unless you provide some examples of your own.

Re: US Copyright Office found AI companies breach copyright. Its boss was fired

#407

Post by 93po »

School-Cotton wrote: post #406
93po wrote: post #404

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i could give examples of both paid and unpaid and have them shot down as "this is crap writing". instead i will simply point out that there is very popular unpaid fiction on the internet, and its popularity is indicative of its quality, even if it doesn't match the standards of a literature PhD for "good writing". so basically go look for the most popular unpaid fiction online and there's your answer. i mean all of t…

I specified "literary fiction" intentionally, because I suspected it would be the hardest kind for you to find, and that good genre fiction (sci-fi, mystery, romance, etc.) would be somewhat more likely (though still unlikely) to be available for free. But you seem to have ignored that stipulation and steered us back to just talking about fiction in general, and also using popularity as a benchmark for quality... > i…

i didnt respond to the literary part because it's moving the goalposts. i don't care about the literary value of things i read for fun, and most people don't as long as the style and structure of writing doesn't stop them from enjoying it. i never made assertions about "literary" fiction writing, just fiction writing in general

Re: US Copyright Office found AI companies breach copyright. Its boss was fired

#408

Post by School-Cotton »

93po wrote: post #407
School-Cotton wrote: post #406

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I specified "literary fiction" intentionally, because I suspected it would be the hardest kind for you to find, and that good genre fiction (sci-fi, mystery, romance, etc.) would be somewhat more likely (though still unlikely) to be available for free. But you seem to have ignored that stipulation and steered us back to just talking about fiction in general, and also using popularity as a benchmark for quality... > i…

i didnt respond to the literary part because it's moving the goalposts. i don't care about the literary value of things i read for fun, and most people don't as long as the style and structure of writing doesn't stop them from enjoying it. i never made assertions about "literary" fiction writing, just fiction writing in general

You didn’t respond to the entire second half of my post.

Re: US Copyright Office found AI companies breach copyright. Its boss was fired

#409

Post by [deleted] »

School-Cotton wrote: post #408
93po wrote: post #407

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i didnt respond to the literary part because it's moving the goalposts. i don't care about the literary value of things i read for fun, and most people don't as long as the style and structure of writing doesn't stop them from enjoying it. i never made assertions about "literary" fiction writing, just fiction writing in general

You didn’t respond to the entire second half of my post.

[deleted]

Re: US Copyright Office found AI companies breach copyright. Its boss was fired

#410

Post by tensor »

rrook wrote: post #229
tensor wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I write a math book, and you read it, then tell someone about the math within it. You are not violating copyright. In fact, you could write your OWN math book, or history book, or whatever, and as long as you're not copying my actual text, you are not violating copyright. However, when an LLM does the same, people now what it to be illegal. It seems pretty straightforward to apply existing copyright law to LLMs in…

That mathematical formulas already cannot be copyrighted makes this a kinda nonsense example?

Math textbooks have words in them. Do you think math books are just bunches of formulas?
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