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Meta's memo to employees rolling back DEI programs

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Re: Meta's memo to employees rolling back DEI programs

#401

Post by polski-g »

specialp wrote: post #385
gorgoiler wrote: post #124

Diversity in tech hiring never felt like the right end of the funnel. It’s why I went into teaching and I’m proud to say after what seems like a ridiculously short amount of time (“they grow up so fast” etc.) the girls from my classes are now entering the work force as SWE and ML interns. Not many, but more than none. When we focus diversity efforts on high school kids then we get a turnaround at the funnel entrypoin…

The start of the funnel is also the most racist and class discriminatory. Almost every school in the USA takes pupils from districts where the property owners pay the taxes for the schools. Rich areas get much more resources and support. Poor students get put into less funded schools and suffer from not having mentorship or peers to look up to. I live on Long Island and we have a majority white population. Despite th…

Most of what you said is just wrong.

"Poor students" have the most support in the country: https://www.mackinac.org/blog/2024/are-poor-urban-districts-... Baltimore public schools get $30k per student. Carmel, IN public schools spend $10k per student.

You should look into heritability. There is no longitudinal impact on adult outcomes as a result of parenting/schooling practices.

Re: Meta's memo to employees rolling back DEI programs

#402

Post by [deleted] »

jiggawatts wrote: post #351
jlhawn wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ... who owned the land ... they didn't use the word "owned", only "occupied". The indigenous groups probably didn't even have anything like our modern concept of land "ownership" and would think of it more like land alienation. As a Georgist, I'm personally very annoyed by these sort of empty indigenous land acknowledgements. I'm more excited about stuff like this Squamish Nation housing development in Vancouver, B…

Here in Australia they use the carefully crafted phrase: “the previous custodians of this land”. As in… we are the custodians now .

[deleted]

Re: Meta's memo to employees rolling back DEI programs

#403

Post by JeremyNT »

loeg wrote: post #45
dagmx wrote: post #4

Meta have some of the most double speak I’ve seen. They’ll say one set of virtuous sounding goals while completely undermining it in the same breath. This is just them running with their tails between their legs before the new admin takes over.

Suppose you made a bad policy decision and want to roll it back. How do you do that? Anything you do is going to piss someone off. I think they're trying to do it in a plausibly reasonable way without shitting on everyone who worked on it for a couple years.

They didn't have to announce shit, much less announce it right as the new regime is taking over. If they wanted to sunset these programs they could've slowly ramped these programs down without saying anything and nobody would've noticed.

This sends a very clear message about what they're trying to do and whose side they are on.

Re: Meta's memo to employees rolling back DEI programs

#404

Post by Dove »

pavl- wrote: post #198
bigstrat2003 wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is just common sense, or should be. Unfortunately common sense is as uncommon as people tend to joke about. So you get a lot of focus on business hiring practices, even though it's literally impossible to hire candidates that don't exist. Sometimes this gets taken to absolutely farcical levels. I recall reading a blog from an Irish writer about how activists were trying to demand that companies there hire black…

One of the smartest people I know almost quit software her first year out of school, because her all-male team spent an afternoon teasing her about how they were going to start a strip poker game and they think she'd be "a natural", or some nonsense like that. Do you think such dynamics introduce barriers to female participation in tech? Do you think focusing solely at the "bottom of the funnel" could still result in…

Your suggestion that bad behavior by all-male teams would be improved by the addition of women rests on a couple of assumptions that are not true: that women are inherently better behaved than men, and that women naturally see each other as being on the same team.

I have been through some really awful experiences in the workplace in the last few years, and some of the most egregiously abusive behavior came from another woman. Women can be incredibly cruel to each other, and this woman in particular seemed to have it out for other women. Women are not inherently saints, and they are not inherently kind to other women.

On the other hand, I have often, often worked on teams that were (except for me) all men, but by and large they were men who had mothers, wives, sisters, and daughters that they loved, and who therefore had no trouble relating to me with respect and affection. While it is true that some men treat women specifically badly, and that some men treat people generally badly, it is not true that men in general treat women badly. Quite the opposite.

It does take a moment, as a woman, to find your feet socially in an all male space. But does it not always take a moment to find your feet in any new space? I have generally found that what makes it go smoothly is the fact that we are all hackers. If anything, it is all the walking on eggshells about sexism that makes social integration awkward at first. People are trying to figure out how they are "supposed" to behave around me, worried that I will be aggressive socially and legally. When we focus on the work we do together and the love we have in common for the field, we become friends naturally and get along well.

I myself think all the hand-wringing over demographics has been a waste of time at best and counterproductive at worst. I think it makes more sense to focus on developing virtue, civility, and good leadership among the people who find themselves here.

Re: Meta's memo to employees rolling back DEI programs

#405

Post by mmooss »

01HNNWZ0MV43FF wrote: post #356
mmooss wrote: post #117

The problem isn't evil, but the lack of any leader standing up for good (using simplistic terms). The evil is always there, in our souls and in our society, as is the good; we just need to choose and use the latter to check the former. Who of any serious stature is standing up to Zuckerberg, Musk, Trump, etc.? The absence - the empty stage - is shocking. It is one of Biden's great responsibilities, but he has long ab…

Zuckerberg and Musk are billionaires, money always grants power. What are Biden and Harris supposed to do when the swathes of land that vote for politicians, don't vote for them? And when Congress doesn't back them up? Should they just... say "Pweeeaase" louder? This is why recently I've switched from "Progressive income taxes are good because we need to fund social programs, and rich people can afford to bear a grea…

Biden and Harris aren't victims, they are leaders; they have have power. Their job is to guide people. They can frame the issues, inspire people, lead them. They can persuade people just as well as others, or better given their authority.

Musk and Zuckerberg and lots of others don't hesitate to lead.

> And when Congress doesn't back them up? Should they just... say "Pweeeaase" louder?

No, that's pretty ignorant about politics. Again, they aren't victims. They make things happen. There are ways to persuade the public and compel Congress. But the Dems have completely abdicated any such thing, as if they aren't politicians or leaders.

Re: Meta's memo to employees rolling back DEI programs

#406

Post by nox101 »

paxys wrote: post #88

DEI was a song and dance that companies put on for the media, politicians, investors, employees, and the public at large. Now anti-DEI is a song and dance for the exact same reason. If you have been in the business long enough, you will know that the company has NO ONE's interests at heart. Never had and never will. They will discriminate against any race they have to, whether majority or minority, if it leads to an…

At the company I work at, IMO, their DEI initiatives are counter productive so they claim "we support DEI", but in actual practice they're making the problem worse not better. It might be true that removing DEI is performative, but at least at my job, removing DEI would be a net positive for actually diversity, equity, and inclusion.

There might be other things they could do proactively. But, the ones they actually chose are derisive, racist, and do nothing to actually make the world a more diverse, equitable, and inclusive place.

Re: Meta's memo to employees rolling back DEI programs

#407

Post by harrall »

firefoxd wrote: post #184

I wrote about my experience working as a software developer and being black in the industry and I was lucky to have it published on BBC [1]. What immediately followed, every large company reached out to have me work as a consultant for their diversity program. I found it fascinating that they had a team of DEI experts in place already. Like what makes one an expert? In addition to my job, I spent nights developing pr…

Personally I feel if you want to make an impact, you need to provide resources early on when people are growing up and in school.

There’s nothing like gaining inspiration because someone you know growing up is doing it. e.g. It’s much easier to go camping for your first time when someone in your life is “the camping person” and can guide you through it. And the earlier you do it, the higher chance that you end up pursuing it.

In a lot of impoverished communities, they don’t have as many as those kinds of people. Especially not compared to a well-connected family in a wealthy suburb.

I don’t know how you would provide those resources and maybe these big companies already are, but the availability of professionals that young people surround themselves with should not be overlooked.

Re: Meta's memo to employees rolling back DEI programs

#408

Post by caturopath »

romellem wrote: post #112

Contrast Meta's stance with Costco's, when [Costco responded][1] to a shareholder that proposed Costco prepare a report on "the risks of the Company maintaining its current DEI roles, policies and goals." Our success at Costco Wholesale has been built on service to our critical stakeholders: employees, members, and suppliers. Our efforts around diversity, equity and inclusion follow our code of ethics: For our employ…

The subject matter is nominally the same, but I don't know how comparable I would guess the situations are. I 100% could see Meta making a very similar statement still today.

Re: Meta's memo to employees rolling back DEI programs

#409

Post by 1over137 »

firefoxd wrote: post #184

I wrote about my experience working as a software developer and being black in the industry and I was lucky to have it published on BBC [1]. What immediately followed, every large company reached out to have me work as a consultant for their diversity program. I found it fascinating that they had a team of DEI experts in place already. Like what makes one an expert? In addition to my job, I spent nights developing pr…

> Like what makes one an expert?

Your skin colour of course.

Re: Meta's memo to employees rolling back DEI programs

#410

Post by janalsncm »

pkkkzip wrote: post #276
barrenko wrote: post #270

[flagged]

I disagree. DEI has nothing to do with an ancient empire.

Charitably, I think they mean we are starting to see explicit alignment between government and the ultra wealthy, which definitely is a threat to democracy. You can either do what is good for the majority or what is good for the 0.0001%.
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