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Air Force picks Anduril, General Atomics to develop unmanned fighter jets

breakingdefense.com

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Re: Air Force picks Anduril, General Atomics to develop unmanned fighter jets

#401

Post by constantcrying »

dgroshev wrote: post #395
constantcrying wrote: post #353

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A 10% success chance seems incredibly effective. I would have estimated the chances quite a bit lower. Tanks are million dollar devices, which are expensive to replace and require significant training. If they can be effectively attacked by infantry without putting themselves in significant danger, that drastically lowers the value of a tank.

We had man-portable ATGMs for decades, they didn't "lower the value of a tank". Less than 10% is not good when you consider how much does it cost in practice. Drone teams are often 2 pilots + technician + explosives technician (an incredibly risky job btw, those bastardised RPG warheads are live and sensitive) + infantry cover. At least double that if you want to strike beyond line of sight and need a retransmitter d…

>We had man-portable ATGMs for decades, they didn't "lower the value of a tank".

Of course they did, arguing anything else is complete lunacy, especially since you later advocate for the usage of Javelins, which, if effective and available, obviously reduce the value of tank. They also have the imense drawback of exposing the soldier to enemy fire.

I don't even get your other points. Why would drone operators be hunted more than Javelin operators? Why would Javelin operators not have to worry about giving away their position? Why don't Javelin operators need infantry cover?

Re: Air Force picks Anduril, General Atomics to develop unmanned fighter jets

#402

Post by ethbr1 »

willcipriano wrote: post #351
ethbr1 wrote: post #338

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Still democratic and #1/#2 in the world, by most measures. Was there something specific you were looking for?

We pay a european level of taxes (and rising) in order to receive a "safety net" thinner than Cuba, mostly so we can drop bombs on brown people and shadowy "communists"/"terrorists"/"freedom haters"/"yellow cake enjoyers"/"nazis that arent Ukrainian". What's the metric for that?

Number of world wars or countries invaded?

Re: Air Force picks Anduril, General Atomics to develop unmanned fighter jets

#403

Post by nerdponx »

psunavy03 wrote: post #271
potatoman22 wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The defense industry isn't just "defense" against bad people. Is it better to optimize the colors of buttons, or work on projects that could potentially kill innocent civilians?

Wars suck. But sometimes the result of not fighting a war sucks more. Sure, military projects could POTENTIALLY kill innocent civilians. But that's not a guarantee, modern Western militaries go out of their way to minimize that, and again sometimes the result of not fighting a war would cause even more innocent people to suffer or die. The idea that "this one bad thing could happen, therefore I will do nothing that c…

There are plenty of things that people can and do in private industry that are significantly more harmful than making some incremental improvement in a weapons platform.

Re: Air Force picks Anduril, General Atomics to develop unmanned fighter jets

#404

Post by erhserhdfd »

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #305

Go find any GUR operator in Ukraine and ask them what they think of Anduril Their proprietary controller doesn’t work with TAK or qgc and they keep everything closed with no interop with the actual FPV or other systems in use daily Unusable in actual war

That's fascinating. Where would you direct someone that is interesting in learning more about these items? Any good sources or websites to read?

Re: Air Force picks Anduril, General Atomics to develop unmanned fighter jets

#405

Post by racional »

kornhole wrote: post #377
jjk166 wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's worth considering that while the equipment in use in the ukraine conflict is obviously relevant, the nature of the conflict is radically different from what the US would face. Ukraine is literally on Russia's doorstep, allowing Russia to send its units in and pull them back for repairs with relatively limited logistical strain. This allows it to use massive numbers of cold war surplus assets that would not be vi…

I agree Ukraine never had a chance against the far superior Russian military. The reason the US and NATO did not officially send ground troops, although many of their people are on the ground, is that it would trigger full war between NATO and Russia which would go thermonuclear. If that ever happened, Russia's larger and more advanced nuclear arsenal (ballistic missiles) would give it an advantage. Their large land…

I agree Ukraine never had a chance against the far superior Russian military.

A very weird thing to say, given Russia's humiliating defeat (in terms of the objectives it believed it would surely and painlessly achieve) in 2022.

Re: Air Force picks Anduril, General Atomics to develop unmanned fighter jets

#406

Post by pixl97 »

nerdponx wrote: post #372
solatic wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We'll see what things look like once the post-drone evolution cycle has turned on the armored side I'm not convinced this is feasible in the short term; drone warfare is predicated on launching not just cheap drones but many of them. The new armor isn't steel or iron to survive the blast, but to shoot down attacking drones before they can explode. Most current defenses are ground-based missile batteries that can't…

Is there ever a world (other than sci-fi) in which drones become a useful countermeasure against other drones?

I mean it seems pretty likely that a smaller, lower range, kill drone could be developed that is designed for the express purpose of identifying other small flying objects and entangling them causing them to drop out of the sky.

The harder part I see is friend/foe identification, rather than just attacking anything else that's small and flying slowly.

Re: Air Force picks Anduril, General Atomics to develop unmanned fighter jets

#407

Post by ninetyninenine »

RealityVoid wrote: post #366
ninetyninenine wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Drones are so cheap you can send a full constellation of drones waaaay cheaper than the cost of one sentry tower and it will defeat it. These systems have limited handling capacity. With enough drones you can get through anything. The main problem is, there are more than enough drones. All I’m saying above is you probably just need 8 of them to get through Andurils system. Also, the method to defeat such systems is n…

My only disagreement with your position is that you seem to evaluate it in a void. Compared to other systems out there, is Anduril really that bad? I suspect if you're in a trench you'd much rather have a system that can down "just" 8 drones at a time than one that can down zero.

True. but these systems are effectively equivalent to void if the enemy can cheaply come up with a way to defeat it.

Re: Air Force picks Anduril, General Atomics to develop unmanned fighter jets

#408

Post by willcipriano »

ethbr1 wrote: post #402
willcipriano wrote: post #351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We pay a european level of taxes (and rising) in order to receive a "safety net" thinner than Cuba, mostly so we can drop bombs on brown people and shadowy "communists"/"terrorists"/"freedom haters"/"yellow cake enjoyers"/"nazis that arent Ukrainian". What's the metric for that?

Number of world wars or countries invaded?

You tell me if you don't know.

Re: Air Force picks Anduril, General Atomics to develop unmanned fighter jets

#409

Post by inemesitaffia »

paganel wrote: post #156
nbzso wrote: post #92

The problem you have, dear Americans is called MIC. Just quoting one of your presidents: >“In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist.” So many wars for profit. History knows best that there is no free lunch. But I suppose…

Let these Westerners drive directly into a ditch, they deserve it. It's like they've learned nothing from the current war in Ukraine. Some people are even mentioning dog-fights, like this is a freaking Top Gun movie or some such (there's no dog-fight against a S-300, I can tell them that). The best thing that they could do would be to "import" a few dozen Ukrainian drone operators and engineers, people who have activ…

The locals can always bring them in to consult.

Weapons and bases aren't just about winning conflicts, they are about jobs (see Perun)

Re: Air Force picks Anduril, General Atomics to develop unmanned fighter jets

#410

Post by coffeeindex »

qarl wrote: post #399
ycombinete wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, the only mention of Oppenheimer in the article is this: > Essentially, Luckey’s aim is to make the US and its allies almost impossible to harm — “a prickly porcupine” in his words — as well as to supply weapons powerful enough to put adversaries off attacking in the first place. “We want to build the capabilities that give us the ability to swiftly win any war we are forced to enter,” he says. > The thesis is not…

Ah - so it was the FT editor that equated Palmer Luckey to Oppenheimer.

Is he not just saying that Palmer Luckey’s “idea” isn’t his own — Oppenheimer for example had it before? That’s hardly equating them
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