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Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

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Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#401

Post by Jensson »

bawolff wrote: post #384
hersko wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey Dang, huge fan of HN. How do you reconcile HN's political neutrality and the fact that almost every overtly political story that hits the front page about certain subjects[1] are blatantly biased on one side? [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39435324

I think part of it is the current situation lends itself to more pro-gaza headlines. For starters the situation is evolving more on that front. Every new action is a potential headline for palestine. On the other hand Israel's position is much more static: They want to prevent the slaughter on oct 7 from happening again, and are using force to do so. That hasn't changed. You can't make new headlines out of it. Its pr…

[flagged]

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#402

Post by kaba0 »

Qem wrote: post #386
throwaway894345 wrote: post #370

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> but all you can muster is evidence that journalists are not being targeted but are rather being killed at rates of other civilians. No, they are being killed at much faster rate, to the point of depletion in relation to other civilians. Look at this plot: https://imgur.com/a/SWNSYOn In my first post in this thread I did a detailed estimate that for the curve to bend this way, the journalists must be decimated with…

Is it actually a reasonable assumption that journalists die at the same rate as civilians? Arguably, journalists are much more susceptible to go to dangerous places, close to actual combat, etc, for better videos.

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#403

Post by trhway »

bawolff wrote: post #384
hersko wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey Dang, huge fan of HN. How do you reconcile HN's political neutrality and the fact that almost every overtly political story that hits the front page about certain subjects[1] are blatantly biased on one side? [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39435324

I think part of it is the current situation lends itself to more pro-gaza headlines. For starters the situation is evolving more on that front. Every new action is a potential headline for palestine. On the other hand Israel's position is much more static: They want to prevent the slaughter on oct 7 from happening again, and are using force to do so. That hasn't changed. You can't make new headlines out of it. Its pr…

[flagged]

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#404

Post by kaba0 »

shprd wrote: post #319
bawolff wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Essentially that implies Israel will get shot at and not be allowed to shoot back. I suspect most Israelis would find that unreasonable. Israeli civilians don't like being killed anymore than Palestinian civilians do. The thing that usually prevents war is that both sides lose in the end. If only one side is allowed to shoot, why would the side being allowed to shoot ever stop? They would be getting all the benefits…

> Israel will get shot at and not be allowed to shoot back. The logic doesn't really follow What shots exactly? the missiles? Attack the launch sites. They're pretty clear as they expose themselves. Israel has 24/7 surveillance it shouldn't be a challenge. Can you support your claim by showing evidence that a hospital was used to launch missiles? You likely don't have evidence that Israel is targeting anything. It se…

[flagged]

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#405

Post by JamesAdir »

ciconia wrote: post #25

> Around 10% of Gaza's journalists have been killed versus 2.5% of healthcare workers. One possible explanation is that journalists have a much higher probability of being close to where the fighting is, than healthcare workers.

Another explanation is that what Gaza authorities define as a journalist/healthcare worker or aid worker, might be very broad. There are reports of UNRWA employees taking part in the terror attack on Israel on 10/7.

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#406

Post by JumpCrisscross »

ars wrote: post #313
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How is trying to storm a sovereign border peaceful? It’s not. But it’s not grounds for lethal force. Audible warnings, warning shots and non-lethal rounds were the right moves.

Someone trying to invade your country to kill people is not grounds for lethal force? You can't possibly be serious.

> Someone trying to invade your country to kill people is not grounds for lethal force?

Sure it is. But that’s not what you described—the border guards did not have enough information to conclude—as judge, jury and executioner—that they were trying to kill people.

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#407

Post by JumpCrisscross »

falcor84 wrote: post #348
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #304

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I would prefer to find an example of a prolonged war rather than an isolated false flag operation During the Chinese civil war, the Maoists let the Nationalists take a shellacking when convenient. And while I wouldn’t say America was conducive to civilian deaths on “our” side in Vietnam or Afghanistan, it clearly wasn’t something we optimised for: our priority was protecting our troops. Hamas is a paramilitary. It…

Apologies for my ignorance, but aren't Hamas literally the government of Gaza? Have they been renounced by the population in favor of any other government?

> aren't Hamas literally the government of Gaza?

The Kims are the government of North Korea. That doesn’t mean they serve its people.

> Have they been renounced by the population in favor of any other government?

Difficult to tell. Hamas did away with elections in their 2007 coup [1].

[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Gaza_(2007)

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#408

Post by JumpCrisscross »

colonCapitalDee wrote: post #289
archagon wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the law permits thousands of innocents to be slaughtered, then maybe it needs to change.

This a common misunderstanding of the international laws of war, and international law in general. In our personal lives the government can compel us to follow the law with the threat of overwhelming force; if I break the law I will be arrested, and regardless of how much I fight back I will not be able to stop it. Laws in our everyday lives are like commands from a parent to a child; the government, as the parent, c…

Exactly. International laws are guidelines more than rules.

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#409

Post by JumpCrisscross »

someotherperson wrote: post #255
immibis wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the point of hiding soldiers among civilian targets if Israel is just going to bomb the civilian targets? The point of any fighter using human shields is that the enemy doesn't fire because they don't want to hurt the human shields . If they're willing to kill the human shields, they don't help you, so why bother with them? This apparent myth rubs me the same way as "there's no food because Hamas is stealing i…

It's just noise. Scaling this to other examples: if there was a school shooter inside a school, should the school be bombed? The answer is a resounding no, but with Gaza it turns into a yes. This is why the common rhetoric given from politicians and jingoists is that all of them are guilty and that no one is innocent. Using the same example, the workers and students of that school are de facto responsible because the…

> if there was a school shooter inside a school, should the school be bombed?

If there were multiple school shooters inside one school, and they were coördinating with other shooters across the country, that becomes a valid trade off. (In a classic solo shooter scenario, everyone you want to save is inside the building. There is no external context.) In the same way that a hijacked plane, post 9/11, is a valid target for being shot down.

Re: Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war

#410

Post by someotherperson »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #409
someotherperson wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's just noise. Scaling this to other examples: if there was a school shooter inside a school, should the school be bombed? The answer is a resounding no, but with Gaza it turns into a yes. This is why the common rhetoric given from politicians and jingoists is that all of them are guilty and that no one is innocent. Using the same example, the workers and students of that school are de facto responsible because the…

> if there was a school shooter inside a school, should the school be bombed? If there were multiple school shooters inside one school, and they were coördinating with other shooters across the country, that becomes a valid trade off. (In a classic solo shooter scenario, everyone you want to save is inside the building. There is no external context.) In the same way that a hijacked plane, post 9/11, is a valid target…

Oh, I thought they're used as human shields.

How many school shooters would need to be in a Florida High School before you think it's worthwhile to bomb it? Just a rough number

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