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Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

cointelegraph.com

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Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#401

Post by latchkey »

AlexandrB wrote: post #372
latchkey wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I work in architecture and year after year the industry is pushing to squeeze every last bit of energy efficiency out of everything. So is the entire bitcoin mining industry, it is built into their ROI. Have you not noticed the J/Ghash ratio over the years?

> Have you not noticed the J/Ghash ratio over the years? This is completely irrelevant because the protocol is designed to scale difficulty with the hashrate. The only benefit of improving J/Ghash is to get a leg up on other bitcoin miners.

If my operation is earning more ROI, that's my benefit.

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#402

Post by dmoy »

lxgr wrote: post #152
wmf wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will note that the ETFs are using Coinbase, Gemini, and Fidelity for custody. These companies have been providing Bitcoin custody for years without being hacked AFAIK.

Most notably, almost all of them seem to be using Coinbase. This makes them a probably unprecedented target for attacks of all kinds...

Makes me wonder if coinbase has the whole Dudes With Big Guns layer of protection that you see at e.g. the fed in NY (where all the gold is) or the bank of England (where all the other gold is)

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#403

Post by shock-value »

david_shi wrote: post #354

Bitcoin exists to solve the principal-agent problem that comes with delegating control of the money supply to singular institutions. If you look at the history of empires, from the Romans to the Han, it is littered with instances of societal decline as a direct result of inflation and overspending. This unilateral currency debasement is much harder if the collective (and global) definition of money is determined by d…

Speaking of Bitcoin specifically, if this is your view then you should take some time to understand the severe societal and economic problems that come with persistent deflation. And more generally, determining the optimal level of the money supply to match the needs of a dynamic economy is not trivial — there is no simple formula involving straightforwardly measurable variables that I am aware of.

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#404

Post by fsckboy »

gruez wrote: post #341
paulpauper wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Weird how the price went to 48k on fake news, with the potential to go even higher until revealed to be fake, but only 47k on the real news?

priced in, probably.

well, or it's tied into all other segments of the economy and those segments have moved up and down due to their own economic forces, and markets balance that with prices.

for bitcoin to move up or down $1000 a day has a variance: call me when we're outlying

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#405

Post by ivancho »

cornholio wrote: post #349
chii wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> move large amounts of money untraceable. paradoxically, bitcoin is the worse at this, since addresses are completely public. Unless you, like satoshi, keep the coin in the address and never spend it, any conversion to value that you can spend, such as cash, is going to be tracible. > Is it a legitimate want? yes. Unless you can prove criminality, there's the assumption of innocence.

> addresses are completely public. Addresses in Bitcoin are pseudoanonymous. Many criminals have evaded prosecution for years (for example, the MtGox thieves) despite moving billions in the clear on the blockchain. You are feigning ignorance about the true nature of Bitcoin which is quite obviously designed to enable very strong privacy, as noted by even by its inventor in the original paper; let's not even discuss t…

MtGox thieves evaded prosecution because no one was doing tracing back then. Chainalysis got started specifically to link all their activity and is now a giant graph connecting all the "pseudonymous" addresses. And the thieves laundered most of their stolen coin through exchanges, not chain transactions, strange how they didn't want that very strong privacy. There's none of that left on Bitcoin, it's been indexed, clustered and mapped.

Obviously there are technologies which enable complete privacy - and like tumblers, any that prove popular will be shut down, there's just too many negative externalities.

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#406

Post by AlexandrB »

738292748 wrote: post #397
1vuio0pswjnm7 wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's probably more comments promoting and defending Bitcoin on HN than ones questioning it. The question I have is why do commenters feel the need to respond to any comment about Bitcoin that is not a (sometimes subtle) promotion or defense of it. A reasonable person might think it's because Bitcoin is only valuable if increasingly more and more people buy it. If it's not increasingly popular or if, God forbid, ev…

Well yeah, there's no need to defend it. Literally nothing would change. I'm just against bullshit arguments such as "any random shitcoin did this, therefore BTC goes in the same bag," or "no! We should absolutely live in a totalitarian dystopia and have governments that track every move we make. God forbid "

> no! We should absolutely live in a totalitarian dystopia and have governments that track every move we make.

Ironically, cryptocurrency will usher in governments tracking every penny we spend since it's all public on a distributed ledger.

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#407

Post by bagels »

paulpauper wrote: post #264
MuffinFlavored wrote: post #218

Looks like these are the 11 tickers? Bitwise (BITB) ARK Invest/21Shares (ARKB) Invesco Galaxy Bitcoin ETF (BTCO) iShares Bitcoin Trust (IBIT) VanEck Bitcoin Trust (HODL) Franklin Bitcoin ETF (EZBC) Fidelity Wise Origin Bitcoin Trust (FBTC) WisdomTree Bitcoin Trust (BTCW) Valkyrie Bitcoin Fund (BRRR) Hashdex Bitcoin Futures ETF (DEFI) Grayscale Bitcoin Trust (GBTC)

Weird how the price went to 48k on fake news, with the potential to go even higher until revealed to be fake, but only 47k on the real news?

I think a lot of people didn't buy the "hacked" explanation for the tweet that went out. Much more likely to have been an early release.

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#408

Post by AlexandrB »

latchkey wrote: post #401
AlexandrB wrote: post #372

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Have you not noticed the J/Ghash ratio over the years? This is completely irrelevant because the protocol is designed to scale difficulty with the hashrate. The only benefit of improving J/Ghash is to get a leg up on other bitcoin miners.

If my operation is earning more ROI, that's my benefit.

The post you were replying to was talking about conserving energy, not maximizing ROI in a zero-sum game:

> I work in architecture and year after year the industry is pushing to squeeze every last bit of energy efficiency out of everything.

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#409

Post by elif »

czl wrote: post #355
elif wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only losers in bitcoin are the ones that stopped. Any 5+ year holding has been ridiculously profitable. In gambling, the longer you continue, the more certain it is that you will lose. Bitcoin is a uniquely ironic form of gambling if it's gambling at all.

> Any 5+ year holding has been ridiculously profitable. The more remarkable a short history the more likely it is not sustainable: Beanie babies, tulips, etc. In a zero sum investment for every win there is a loss. Bitcoin however is highly negative sum. For every win there are far more losses. Who do you suppose pays hourly train loads of coal turned into CO2? How many years now?

Your two examples, beanie babies(4-5 yrs bubble) and tulip mania (16 months) did not even last long enough for a 5 year comparison. Bitcoin is turning 15 this year.

Re: Spot Bitcoin ETF receives official approval from the SEC

#410

Post by dcolkitt »

lmm wrote: post #390
dcolkitt wrote: post #350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess what exactly do you define as scamming? In terms of outright fraud, I agree there's a lot. It shouldn't be super surprising that scammers tend to prefer decentralized permissionless financial rails, for the same reason that political extremists and pornographers were some of the biggest earliest users of the decentralized permissionless publishing rails of the early Internet. But I wouldn't characterize all,…

> Are memecoins a scam? I would say they're more like a massively multiplayer form of gambling. They're practically indistinguishable from penny-stock scams, and they almost always involve a bunch of outright lies in their promotional materials; the only reason you can argue that many buyers aren't deceived is because lying is so rampant and expected in that space that people take it as given that the claims are goin…

> All of which still fails to add up to anything actually working and useful, 15 years in.

The first packet switched network came online in 1969. Fifteen years by 1984 almost all the use cases were hobby, and it'd be another ten years before the Internet really started changing life.

Decentralized consensus is a fundamentally new computing primitive, similar to packet switched networks. Developing applications on top of new primitives is hard and long, and there will be a lot of time required just to build out usable infrastructure.

Turing complete smart contracts are only 7 years old. Layer 2 scaling is only two years old. Decentralized exchanges and other on-chain financial contracts about four years old.

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