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Why aren't motherboards mostly USB-C by now? (2021)

philip.greenspun.com

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Re: Why aren't motherboards mostly USB-C by now? (2021)

#401

Post by tremon »

korginator wrote: post #27

USB-A should be relegated to the rubbish-heap of poorly designed interfaces for the simple reason that it has no physical indication (e.g., RS-232C) or clear visual indicator for orientation, and you get it wrong 50% of the time. It's way beyond time the USB-A interface is eliminated. USB-C can't get here fast enough. My MacBook pro only has USB-C ports, they work well for data, video out, as well as power (charging)…

and you get it wrong 50% of the time

I've seen this mentioned before, and I don't get it. Never ever have I inserted an USB-type A plug upside down. There have been instances where I had to fumble around to find the right port, but that never resulted in inserting the plug in the wrong way. How much force do you need to apply to even achieve that?

Re: Why aren't motherboards mostly USB-C by now? (2021)

#402

Post by Zak »

ben-schaaf wrote: post #147
lxgr wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sometimes I look at USB-C plugs and US power outlets and wonder if there’s a shock hazard there…

I look at US outlets and wonder about shock hazards.

I think most people in the US have stuck a finger between the two completely uninsulated prongs of a plug and got a shock, usually during childhood. They usually only do it once.

Re: Why aren't motherboards mostly USB-C by now? (2021)

#404

Post by cesarb »

guidoism wrote: post #172

I own several devices that won’t work with a C-to-C cable. Somehow something gets confused. You need to use a C-to-A cable and if you have a computer that only has C ports like me, then you need to use an A-to-C dongle. What a mess.

> I own several devices that won’t work with a C-to-C cable. Somehow something gets confused. You need to use a C-to-A cable

These devices are probably missing the resistors between each of the two CC pins and the ground, which are necessary to tell the computer on the other end of the C-to-C cable "I'm a device and need you to put 5V on the power pins". The C-to-A cable, on the other hand, always has that 5V power (because the A end of the connection always supplies power; that's the reason why A-to-A cables are forbidden, they would short together the power supply of both ends), which means the device gets powered even if it's missing the CC resistors.

That is, it's a manufacturing defect, and the device was probably tested only with C-to-A cables; once C-to-C cables become more common (at least where I live, it took a long time before I managed to even find one, while C-to-A cables were plentiful and many devices came with one), this will become less of a problem.

Re: Why aren't motherboards mostly USB-C by now? (2021)

#405

Post by fortran77 »

fragmede wrote: post #399
nickpeterson wrote: post #372

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really wish we’d end up with something like the old MagSafe.

maybe we can get that for USB-D in 2025 after the Apple magsafe patent runs out

Microsoft had a magnetic connector on the Surface laptops so I don’t thing patents are standing in the way.

Re: Why aren't motherboards mostly USB-C by now? (2021)

#406

Post by meepmorp »

jstanley wrote: post #279
dcow wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. If we designed everything around its “bodge together in a pinch factor” we wouldn’t have technology let alone industry. It’s just not realistic or practical to live in the past and I do not believe it would be oppressive to ask people who still have a use for type A to buy a $5 adapter. Also the type C connector retains the exact pins you need to use it in 2.0 mode, they’re just smaller. Literally all these adapt…

> people who still have a use for type A Isn't this basically everyone? I can count on one hand the number of times I've seen something that plugs into type C and it's not either a phone charger or a type A adapter.

> I can count on one hand the number of times I've seen something that plugs into type C and it's not either a phone charger or a type A adapter.

By way of comparison, my experience is basically the opposite. Most of USB devices I have attached to my computers are USB-C - my keyboard, local backup disks and non-perf critical mass storage, my yubikeys, one of my monitors, network dongles. Most of the USB-A things I have around are for recharging stuff, plus old external disks I keep out of paranoia, and, things like my car's ports for connecting my phone for CarPlay.

The last one is something that annoys me about the EU's insistence on USB-C for phones. I had a bunch of perfectly serviceable USB-A to lightning cables to discard because the connectors have changed for no benefit to me. It seemed driven more by dogmatism than any practical advantages in real life. None of the shit I need to plug the phone into changed their connectors, so I just need to replace cables for no good reason.

Re: Why aren't motherboards mostly USB-C by now? (2021)

#407

Post by [deleted] »

dcow wrote: post #177
treyd wrote: post #120

It's very easy to bodge together a USB-A connector in a pinch in a way that USB-C just isn't. USB-A is simple and there's literally tens of billions of devices that would be made just a little bit closer to being e-waste if USB-A ports became substantially less common than they already are on mainstream devices. Adapters exist and should exist, but we shouldn't have to rely on them.

No. If we designed everything around its “bodge together in a pinch factor” we wouldn’t have technology let alone industry. It’s just not realistic or practical to live in the past and I do not believe it would be oppressive to ask people who still have a use for type A to buy a $5 adapter. Also the type C connector retains the exact pins you need to use it in 2.0 mode, they’re just smaller. Literally all these adapt…

[deleted]

Re: Why aren't motherboards mostly USB-C by now? (2021)

#408

Post by diffeomorphism »

nickpeterson wrote: post #372
arghwhat wrote: post #354

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Funny you say that, I can tell from family experience that USB type A ports are quite fragile to a vertical tug as it breaks the internal plastic bar at its base so you're left with a hole full of floating copper pins. It of course requires more than a light tug, but less than you'd think. The USB-C housing is much more rigid than that of type A, so it should handle this much better. The thinner bar might also handle…

I really wish we’d end up with something like the old MagSafe.

What is your opinion on magnetic usb c adapters? For about 10€ you get 140W charging and 40Gbps.

Compared to magsafe it is not recessed (though that has not been an issue in my experience), but on the plus side it also does data, video and is universal. Currently using the same type of adapter for my laptop, phone and tablet with the ends on various chargers and docking stations.

Re: Why aren't motherboards mostly USB-C by now? (2021)

#409

Post by justsomehnguy »

accrual wrote: post #119
cesarb wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having them be USB C would mean they could only be used on USB C ports (adapters from USB C socket to USB A plug are forbidden by the USB standard, because they would allow creating the forbidden USB A to USB A cable), while having them be USB A allows them to be used on both USB A ports and (with a simple passive adapter) USB C ports.

> forbidden USB A to USB A cable In the early days of USB before flash drives were common, I was convinced such a cable would let me connect two PCs together to transfer data. Spent some time looking around in stores before a kind sales rep advised they did not exist.

But they do, but they aren' passive and require drivers https://www.amazon.com/Plugable-Transfer-Compatible-Computer...

Re: Why aren't motherboards mostly USB-C by now? (2021)

#410

Post by onetimeuse92304 »

diffeomorphism wrote: post #408
nickpeterson wrote: post #372

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really wish we’d end up with something like the old MagSafe.

What is your opinion on magnetic usb c adapters? For about 10€ you get 140W charging and 40Gbps. Compared to magsafe it is not recessed (though that has not been an issue in my experience), but on the plus side it also does data, video and is universal . Currently using the same type of adapter for my laptop, phone and tablet with the ends on various chargers and docking stations.

I had a number of them from two or three different brands.

They had tendency to cause sparking and I lost at least one phone due to it. The phone was fine but it lost ability to be charged through the USB port. And because it did not have wireless charging, when the battery ran out it became an expensive brick.

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