Yes, tactile buttons are better for the user. But that won't matter in the long run as cars become more and more autonomous. Tesla's FSD for instance is far from perfect (and MobilEye will bring this to other brands), but when not actively controlling the vehicle 99% of the time, tactile buttons vs touchscreens becomes much less of an issue.
Automakers are starting to admit that drivers hate touchscreens
401–410 of 1001 posts
Re: Automakers are starting to admit that drivers hate touchscreens
#402I feel compelled to share a video, now 9 years old, that shows how touch screens could be accommodated with sensible design in cars. The UIs we are used to on our phones are not suitable for driving, but we could make something that is. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XVbuk3jizGM
This looks horrible to use to me.
Re: Automakers are starting to admit that drivers hate touchscreens
#403Earlier quoted context omitted.
I believe that the engineers are competent at developing software, and think that a lot of the quality issues are due to engineers abdicating authority over the software to managers and never saying "No, adding in that feature at this point in the timeline is going to make this a steaming pile of shit and I refuse to do it and still call myself a software engineer." I get that we have families to feed, but I've seen…
I have a 2 month old baby, and got fired from my last job after 6 months of unpaid overtime... I am currently trying (again) to get into embedded development. I would gladly take the job of the guy that refused to make shitty software, if that means I can keep feeding my baby. Unless it would be too unethical. (I refuse to do work that will kill people, for example I won't work for Palantir, companies that make sketc…
> I refuse to do work that will kill people
Isn’t a crappy UI on a car something that could kill people?
Re: Automakers are starting to admit that drivers hate touchscreens
#404I wouldn't mind touchscreens as long as these imbecile developers would strictly limit UI response time to under 16ms. In no world where you're barrelling 3,000+ lbs of mass at tens of miles an hour should you be distracted by some moronic app or subsystem failing to respond in time because it was written by under-experienced software "engineers." Any software running as a part of a motor vehicle should be federally…
> It's absolutely ridiculous that this still happens today, and it doesn't have to.
But then how will the suits save 5¢ per car by buying antiquated hardware instead of something appropriate that can perform the tasks requested of it efficiently?
Re: Automakers are starting to admit that drivers hate touchscreens
#405With. A. Passion. Other touch screens (or similar things) I dislike: - the controls on my stove top - the controls on my monitor - the controls on my tv - the controls on my thermostat - probably more All of these should have physical buttons for the limited number of functions required. Or, at a minimum, for navigation and confirmation. Touch screens there suck. My wife's car has a touch screen on the control/infota…
How often are you changing the clock?
Re: Automakers are starting to admit that drivers hate touchscreens
#406I wouldn't mind touchscreens as long as these imbecile developers would strictly limit UI response time to under 16ms. In no world where you're barrelling 3,000+ lbs of mass at tens of miles an hour should you be distracted by some moronic app or subsystem failing to respond in time because it was written by under-experienced software "engineers." Any software running as a part of a motor vehicle should be federally…
"That physical button that takes 500ms to respond is still as dangerous"
No it's not. With mechanical buttons you have tactile feedback, that is you don't have to look except in the broadest sense to get the general direction. Tactile feedback not only tells you that you have the correct position but also lets you know when the job is complete. That's why rotary potentiometers with knobs make much better volume controls and so on.
Can you imagine trying to play a piano with a glass keyboard? It'd be damn near impossible even for the most skilled pianist as nearby keys wouldn't provide tactile positioning. Same goes for a typewriter or computer keyboard. If you've ever used a flat panel keyboard you'll understand the problem.
Re: Automakers are starting to admit that drivers hate touchscreens
#407Earlier quoted context omitted.
I believe that the engineers are competent at developing software, and think that a lot of the quality issues are due to engineers abdicating authority over the software to managers and never saying "No, adding in that feature at this point in the timeline is going to make this a steaming pile of shit and I refuse to do it and still call myself a software engineer." I get that we have families to feed, but I've seen…
Yep. It's part of your job to tell managers "yes, it's possible, but it'll negatively affect performance in a significant way because of such and such hardware limitations, so it's not the most valuable feature to implement at this time".
And it's part of the manager's job to tell you "I agree but don't care. Do it anyway or I will find somebody else to do it. For cheaper." Always remember that you are replaceable.
When the newborn is crying and wants food you do what you've got to do. And there are many people like that.
Re: Automakers are starting to admit that drivers hate touchscreens
#408I think the vision of many car makers (Tesla at least) is self-driving and voice commands. In that context, the question touch screen vs physical buttons doesn't matter.
> (Tesla at least) is self-driving Oh yeah.. how's that going?
Re: Automakers are starting to admit that drivers hate touchscreens
#409Another thing I hate: user interfaces in which the visual/audible feedback is independent of whether the input has taken effect. This is distressingly common. Even self-checkout tills in supermarkets do this. For example, you touch a button on the screen, and it changes colour briefly, seemingly to indicate that the button press has been registered, but then nothing happens and you have to press the button again to get your receipt printed or whatever. This is the more common case, but sometimes with the same device you also have the button press taking effect without the visual feedback.
I think I observed full independence of feedback and effect with a physical button on a microwave oven: when you attempted to press the button you sometimes got a beep, and the time sometimes got incremented by 10 s, or perhaps 20 s, and sometimes you'd get both those things, and sometimes you'd get just one of them. It must take real skill to design an appliance with a physical button that "works" like that, but some genius engineer managed to do it. I hope that person never gets a job in the car industry.
Re: Automakers are starting to admit that drivers hate touchscreens
#410Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm currently going through a quote cycle and one of my requirements for the component is a sub 8min boot, which the tier 1/2s are pushing back on as unreasonable. The insanity is real.
8 minutes? What component takes 8 minutes to start?
That can include booting after an update and self tests, but yes, nothing about the component should take that anywhere near that long. We just needed a number to design the manufacturing workflow and assumed it was a reasonable ceiling. They simply don't want to do the (potential) optimization work as part of their initial contract if they somehow manage to exceed it.