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Bolt announces layoffs

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Re: Bolt announces layoffs

#401

Post by SamReidHughes »

synu wrote: post #394
berberous wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The strike prices of options are set based on a 409A valuation. These are "cashless" loans, which are recourse for tax purposes (so that the IRS respects this as a true purchase of shares, in order to start people's LTCG and QSBS clocks). The terms were likely very favorable, i.e. set with an interest rate equivalent to the AFR. This is not a situation in which the company is trying to make money as a lender. This is…

If you can’t afford to buy your options, but take out a personal loan to buy them, that must have been a riskier approach than just buying them if you had the cash, no? The leverage increases the personal risk at least as I understand how that works. Unless there was an agreement to forgive the loans if the options go underwater, which I haven’t seen reported here.

It depends on what your future income stream looks like. If you're a 22-24 year old software developer, getting to take on low-interest debt in an inflationary environment is a great deal. It's losing money on the stock that is the problem here.

Re: Bolt announces layoffs

#402

Post by doctor_eval »

thwarted wrote: post #296
version_five wrote: post #291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've seen companies with less revenue and a bigger workforce growing at that rate. They call it blitz-scaling, and I don't know if it's actually ever worked, where I saw it first hand it was basically just setting a pile of money on fire.

Yep, this is what happens when your "growth" metric is employee headcount, under the naïve assumption that more people is a proxy for more work getting done is a proxy for revenue. This may make more sense for a sales-focused organization, less so for marketing or technology driven organization.

Maybe not a proxy per se, but more like a leading indicator, right? Those big enterprise customers might not ask about revenue, but the sales unit can certainly brag about headcount.

Re: Bolt announces layoffs

#403

Post by lazide »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #381
pevey wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have an ecommerce web site for a smallish regional coffee company I own. I heard about Bolt and was interested enough to go to their web site to learn more. Could not find a pricing page. Saw a form where you can request a demo. Realized it was one of those products. Left immediately. I don't have time for that song and dance. No wonder they can't grow market share.

> Realized it was one of those products. A product not intended for an SMB, but instead one targeted at large enterprises?

A product that may not even exist? Or require your own engineering team to make work?

Re: Bolt announces layoffs

#404

Post by aabhay »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #392
sparrc wrote: post #368

I'm a bit naive on this space so forgive if this is an ignorant question; Can anyone explain how any of these companies (Bolt, Fast, 1o) are doing anything different than "checkout with paypal"? What exactly is wrong with paypal that would make a merchant want to use Bolt instead?

The idea is that a central 1-click checkout provider will store your payment information, shipping address, and other details after the first time you use a site with their checkout. The next time you checkout on any website that uses the same 1-click checkout provider, they already have your information for “1-click” checkout. The investment thesis is that if 1-click checkout were to take off, it would become a winn…

PayPal has had this for a very, very long time. I use it all the time, and it works great. So what am I missing? I also have Apple Pay enabled. It works great as well. The use of hardware verification vs a browser redirect gives it some nice advantages. So what exactly is the differentiated experience I’m getting with Bolt?

Re: Bolt announces layoffs

#405

Post by alexb_ »

doctor_eval wrote: post #402
thwarted wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, this is what happens when your "growth" metric is employee headcount, under the naïve assumption that more people is a proxy for more work getting done is a proxy for revenue. This may make more sense for a sales-focused organization, less so for marketing or technology driven organization.

Maybe not a proxy per se, but more like a leading indicator, right? Those big enterprise customers might not ask about revenue, but the sales unit can certainly brag about headcount.

The moment that any indicator becomes a goal it instantly becomes completely useless as an indicator or metric for anything.

Re: Bolt announces layoffs

#406

Post by ergocoder »

kumarm wrote: post #163
aabhay wrote: post #157

I called it ages ago -- this company is an utter train wreck. I am honestly ashamed of the entire industry for birthing and fostering this basically fraudulent company. Its mistakes and lies are compounding on themselves, creating awful outcomes for its employees: - Company almost certainly juiced its usage numbers, potentially by buying users to inflate its customers revenues, so it could use those numbers to convin…

wouldn't Fast be the Theranos even by your description? Bolt definitely has some explaining todo with employee stock options but calling it Theranos seems little extreme.

Not by a long shot.

Fast didn't inflate their revenue.

Bolt encouraged employees to take the loan to exercise stock. And Bolt's founder founded that loan company.

Fast definitely didn't do that

Calling it theranos seems fair...

Re: Bolt announces layoffs

#407

Post by IG_Semmelweiss »

berberous wrote: post #137
nemothekid wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Companies lining up recourse financing for their employees should. Wait the companies set these loans up? I thought they were just going to a bank and getting something akin to a personal loan or some other 3rd party collateralized loan. Might as well work for free at that point.

It's a cashless loan. If you have options that cost $10,000 to exercise, the company lets you pay with a promissory note (promising to pay the $10,000, plus minimal interest set at the IRS's AFR). This is effectively the same as the company loaning you $10k, and then you hand it back over to exercise, but the cash does not change hands. If you were to get a private loan, the interest would be much higher. The company…

Re: last paragraph

Is it realistic for a bankruptcy trustee to come after employees that signed uo for a personal loan for shares in a company now worth zero.

Is there a documented case of this happening and suceeding?

Re: Bolt announces layoffs

#408

Post by tomcam »

nrmitchi wrote: post #178
aabhay wrote: post #157

I called it ages ago -- this company is an utter train wreck. I am honestly ashamed of the entire industry for birthing and fostering this basically fraudulent company. Its mistakes and lies are compounding on themselves, creating awful outcomes for its employees: - Company almost certainly juiced its usage numbers, potentially by buying users to inflate its customers revenues, so it could use those numbers to convin…

> I've never seen the technology used on any website, and I am a frequent online shopper. I went down this rabbit hole last month. While not directly related to the current topic, it might help explain why you've "never seen it": https://twitter.com/nrmitchi/status/1519174682863226880

Great thread. Be nice if journalists could manage that level of sophistication.

Re: Bolt announces layoffs

#409

Post by moneywoes »

abraxas wrote: post #306
alberth wrote: post #303

Earlier quoted context omitted.

~$20M in revenue from ~50 employees, equating to $400k in revenue/employee is extremely impressive for an early stage company. What company is that?

We aren't early stage. We have a growing revenue stream but have been at it for about 5 years with some ups and downs along the way. There is a product market fit but the product still needs a lot of work on being more scalable (in terms of process).

What are your primary customer acquisition channels?

Re: Bolt announces layoffs

#410

Post by twodave »

aeyes wrote: post #379
sparrc wrote: post #368

I'm a bit naive on this space so forgive if this is an ignorant question; Can anyone explain how any of these companies (Bolt, Fast, 1o) are doing anything different than "checkout with paypal"? What exactly is wrong with paypal that would make a merchant want to use Bolt instead?

And since Amazon now also came out with such a payment button, how are they going to compete against a company which already has an enormous user base with their credit card data on file? That they were able to raise 1B$ is a true dotcom era déjà vu.

Amazon built the original. I think these copycats have sprung up as a result of a patent expiration the early 2000s.
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